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• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP73B00296R000500040030-0
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• Document Page Count: 10
• Document Creation Date: December 19, 2016
• Document Release Date: September 22, 2005
• Sequence Number: 30
• Publication Date: November 5, 1971
• Content Type: MEMO

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 s 17 `? Approved For Rele i_%ffif lg ,aA jIW. 2?~W 00040030-October 29, 1971
to know the President's rationale for con- Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I much too much money, and there is no
tinuing or cutting off aid to a country, yield back the remainder of my time. point in my reiterating it.
and also to facilitate an independent ap- Mr. RANDOLPH. Mr. President, I yield It was my understanding-and the
praisal of the President's actions by Con- back the remainder of my time. only excuse I can offer why the Senator
gress. The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time from Alaska is not here is that there has
My amendment would also require the on the amendment having been yielded been a change of signals-that the
President to report any action taken pur- back, the question is on agreeing to the Allott-Church amendment was coming
suant to paragraph (3) of subsection 620 " amendment. up. Now the Senator from Alaska wishes
(v). That provision allows the President The amendment was agreed to. to present a substitute, I believe, or an
to continue or resume aid to countries Mr. SYMINGTON, Mr. President, will amendment to the amendment of the
which either first, take appropriate meas- the Senator yield? Senator from Missouri, and I understand
ures to halt drug trafficking after an Mr. FULBRIGHT. I understood the it would be in order. He wishes, I believe,
earlier determination by the President Senator from Idaho (Mr. CHURCH) to to strike it out-to strike out aid to
that such measures have not been taken say he expected the Senator from Mis- Cambodia. I believe it has been at the
by such countries, or second, require as- souri to proceed. Or am I in error about desk. I think he ought to have an oppor-
sistance from the United States because that? tunity to present it, but there is a change
of "overriding national interest,". even Mr. MANSFIELD. Go ahead, of signals here at the last minute. I did
though appropriate steps to combat drug The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- _ not know it was ,going to come up just
trafficking have not been taken. 'filLor from Missouri is recognized. now, because I thought the Church-,
In my opinion the overriding national Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, my Allott amendment would be next in line.
interest must be grave indeed to excuse/ perfecting amendment, as printed- and But I wonder if the Senator from Mis-
a country from taking steps to eliminate as it appears in the RECORD, contains a souri would be willing, if he has any
drug traffic to the United States or its printing error which I would correct at further remarks to make, to make those
citizens, and I would expect the fullest this time. remarks now. If not, I am perfectly
justification for any presidential deter- The amount to be inserted in lieu of willing, after a reasonable opportunity to
mination to continue aid which is based $250 million in lines 14 and 20 of page reach the Senator from Alaska, to pro-
on overriding national interest. 44 should be $341 million in each in- ceed to a vote.
Except for the absence of a Presidential stance. Mr. AIKEN. Mr. President, will the
reporting requirement, I am, I repeat, I send a corrected copy of the amend- Senator yield?
pleased with the international drug con- ment to the desk, and ask that it be read. Mr. SYMINGTON. I am glad to yield
trol provisions included in H.R. 9910 by The PRESIDING OFFICER. The to the able Senator.
the Committee on Foreign Relations. I amendment, as modified, will be stated. Mr. AIKEN. I support the move of the
hope that the chairman and members The assistant legislative clerk read as Senator from Missouri for increasing the
of that committee support this amend- follows: available amount for Cambodia, because
ment, and that the Senate accept it. On page 44, line 14, strike out "$250,000,- I feel that we have a very great respon-
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, will 000" and insert in lieu thereof "$341,000,000". sibility for the pathetic condition of that
the Senator yield? On page 44, line 20, strike out '1$250,000,- country today. And while I would not
Mr. RANDOLPH. I yield. 000" and insert in lieu thereof $341,000,000". want to see this money spent for raising
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I have discussed The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair an army and putting men to war against
this matter with the Senator from West will state that there are 9 minutes re- their neighbors, I feel that if this amount
Virginia. The substantive provision rem' maining to each side on this amend- of $341 million is agreed to at this time,
lating to drug traffic, as he rightly says, ment. Who yields time? it undoubtedly will not survive the con-
is in the bill. As far as I know, it is non- ference at that full amount, though it
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, I
controversial and no one is against it. might, but I doubt in any case if it
I think he fs.thoughtful and wise in pro- ask for the yeas and nays on my per- would survive in the Appropriations
Petting amendment.
viding that the President report to the The yeas and nays were ordered. Committee; so we are not spending this
Congress. I certainly would accept the Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, a $341 million, we are simply making it
amendment. I think the President cer- parliamentary inquiry, to repair much of the damage
.
tainly would have no objection, and which we have in part caused over there.
probably would welcome this opportu- The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- ator will state it. SYMINGTON. May I say to the
nits to report to Congress. . Senator from Vermont that the reason Mr. I accept the amendment. mains on the FULBRIGHT. perfecting How much time amendment re of - for my amendment has much- to do with
Mr. RANDOLPH. I am grateful to the the Senator from Missouri? the McGee amendment which yesterday
chairman of the commitee. PRESIDING OFFICER. Nine min- was defeated. The McGee amendment
Mr. JAVITS. Mr. President, will the The
ut on each side. Who yields N time? would have taken away any ceiling on the
Senator yield? amount of money that was being re-
Mr. RANDOLPH. I yield. Mr. GRIFFIN. Mr. President, a par- quested by the administration for use
Mr. JAVITS. Mr. President, New York liamentary inquiry. in Cambodia. My amendment agrees
is having probably the biggest problem in The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- with all the money that was requested
the country in this area--not only that, ator will state it. by the administration, but says that be-
but drug traffic is probably the greatest Mr. GRIFFIN. To whom is the time fore they spend additional money, they
problem New York has ever had-I am allotted? should come to Congress for authoriza-
very anxious to work at this end to try The PRESIDING OFFICER. To the tion. That is the amendment that we
to damp the flow. There are three ele- Senator from Missouri and the Senator are discussing now. .
ments to damping the flow: First, the from Arkansas. Who yields time? Mr. President, I am prepared to yield
illegality. of the crime in pushing and Mr. MANSFIELD. Time is running on back the remainder of my time.
wholesaling drugs; second, rehabilitat- both sides. Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, first will
ing drug addicts and trying to eliminate The PRESIDING OFFICER. If no one the Senator yield to me for a question?
the problem; and third, keeping the ad- yields time, time will run against both Mr. SYMINGTON. I am glad to yield
diet from engaging in crime. sides. to the Senator from Mississippi on my
I am glad the chairman of the com- Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I time.
mittee has accepted the amendment. I yield myself 3 minutes for the purpose 'Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, this is
think the Senator has rendered us all of an inquiry. The Senator from Missouri largely a matter of legislative history,
a service in keeping the administration's is now offering a perfecting amendment and I wish to ask the Senator some ques-
feet to the fire in a proposition as crit- to increase the amount of the ceiling tions after I make a very brief state-
ical as this one. for money to Cambodia from $250 mil- ment.
Mr. RANDOLPH, I appreciate the " lion to what figure? This pertains, now, to the money that
comments of the Senator from New Mr. SYMINGTON. The sum of $341 can be spent in Cambodia. When we had
York. I know he has gv m ch atten- million is the amount requested by the the procurement bill up, we had a similar
tion to the APVIEIKVAM i 31 M&,9.2WMt21tip IA-RDP73B00296R000g04O Gd reference to how much
terest in stopping the illegal traffic in ' Mr. FULBRIGHT. That is correct. I could be spent in Laos. We excepted the
drugs. have already stated that I think this is bombing in both areas, and agreed on a
 October 2 ppf9Ygd For Relet~ ~ /j~jN Ai 1 2 90500040030-0 O Ill;i$
$350 million figure, which was the budg- ministration's adjacent departments first us in the form of the Gulf of Tonkin res-
et request, and I agreed to the amend- declare something useless and then givo olution. At that time, we were misled by
anent on that basis. it away to the Cambodians. We do not lies about what had happened, and our
The amendment would actually, want to waste time in the Senate by in emotions were appealed to-we were told
though, put that as an annual ceiling, a effect setting a ceiling which is the we had been attacked on the open seas
legislative ceiling, which I thought was amount they request then have them go in an unprovoked manner, and I and ev-
all right; you can hardly argue against millions beyond the ceiling by declaring erybody else except two Members of the
it. worthless a lot of equipment they later Senate fell for it.
I said to the Senator from Missouri, as put to use in Cambodia. I believe this There is no excuse now for a similar
he related yesterday in my absence, that clause is constructive as written in the mistake. Our eyes are open. We know
I would support a similar situation as to bill. what is going on. We know the greatest
Cambodia, to take the budget figure, as Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, we are tragedy and loss to this country since
we did before. trying to make legislative history and the civil war is going on in Asia. Why do
He has now amended his amendment, are not particularly arguing the bill. I we wish to go down this road again in
as I understand it, to $341 million, which have tentatively agreed to this figure, Cambodia and in Laos?
is the amount of the budget request. but it was with the understanding that We are headed in this direction be-
We do carry the idea in the bill, though, we were not going to be left in the dark cause of the dominant influence of the
that this is a legislative ceiling for one as to interpretations. I think the 33'/3 military committee and the military es-
year. percent figure is a reasonable amount, tablishment in this country. I know of no
Mr. SYMINGTON. That is correct. but I do not want any unknown restric- reason for it other than they want to do
Mr. STENNIS. All right. I think that is tions in this language, and the Senator it. No good reason has been given to me
sound. does not, either. as to why we want to organize and pay
Now, there is some language in the bill Mr. SYMINGTON. No. That is right. for an enormous army in Cambodia. I
that uses the word "expenditures." This Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, with the' am against it.
is technical language that I think ought - understanding about this language and I realize that the votes are here; and
to be cleared up. It could be cleared up with what' clarification may be neces- if I am the only one who votes against it,
in conference. The question about expen- sary as to the word "expenditure" in con- I will, because at issue is whether we are
ditures or authorizations or commit- ference, I can support the amendment. going to construct an enormous army of
ments-I do not know what all the terms Mr. SYMINGTON. I thank the Sena- Cambodians. We have already approved
are, but what I wanted to make clear is tor. one in Laos and, of course, Thailand has
that this amendment will have no limi- The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time enormous amounts of money in here for
tations on the spending, if they see fit, of of the Senator from Missouri has expired. the maintenance and construction of an
up to some $341 million; is that correct? ' Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, how enoroinus army. When I say "enormous,"
Mr. SYMINGTON. That is my under- ? much time do I have remaining? I am referring to the fact that it is far
standing. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Six beyond the capacity of these little coun-
Mr. STENNIS. Yes. And the Senator minutes. tries to support the military establish-
does not intend to limit, after agreeing to Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I meats we encourage on them.. Cambodia
this $341-million, in any way the expen- think this is a very inconsistent policy; had approximately 35,000 in her army
diture of it for purposes in Cambodia? this amendment rapidly escalates our- when Sihanouk left the country. We have
Mr. SYMINGTON. The Senator is cor- expenditures in Cambodia. already built that up to 185,000, and-
rect. The Senator from Missouri, I know, there are reports to the effect that by
Mr. STENNIS, If the Senator will yield was committed to amend his amendment 1975 or 1976 they will have 300,000. We'
further, what is an expenditure in this from $25 million to $341 million, be- pay all the bills. Here is a limit of $341
field sometimes requires a definition or an cause he recognized the fact of life that million. Next year it will by $500 million,
understanding, and I will illustrate. the influence of the Armed Services Com-, and the next year it probably will be
Some of these goods are used jeeps, we mittee is dominant in this body. But he $700 million, That is the road, we are
will say, that we would send over into wanted an expression of a principle, that headed down.
Cambodia. I am just illustrating. Congress still has a slight, remote func- If we had been attacked, or were about
That is a used item, and there has to be tion to play in the foreign policy field. to be destroyed, nobody would hesitate
some ground rule on how it is going to If the Senator from Missouri had offered to respond. There is .that difference be-
be evaluated in money figures. It is not an amount $1 under what the Pentagon tween Tonkin Gulf and this. There we
an expenditure of new money; it is just wanted, it would have the opposition of had been told, erroneously, that we had
the sending over of ,war material. , the Armed Services Committee, and the been attacked, and we fell for it. There
Does the Senator understand it that amendment would fail. ' is no similar excuse in this case. We are
way, and would he be amenable, in con- Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, will the deliberately undertaking obligations far
ference, if this amendment passes, to Senator yield? beyond the needs and against the inter-
having ground rules established, the ones Mr. FULBRIGHT. I will yield in a ests of Cambodia. The people of Cam-
that are used now? moment. bodia are going to be the victims here,
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, I ' I will not trade on any such basis. It just as the people of Vietnam have been
want to be careful not to say something is not the money that is bothering me, the victims of that situation. The people
at variance with the language of the bill, although I think we are in bad shape of Cambodia do not want this to happen
The bill provides: and cannot afford it. It is the principle to them. They would like us to go home
For the purpose of this subsection, 'value' of now starting to construct an enormous and .leave them alone.
means the fair market value of any goods, military machine, using foreign bodies Somebody said that we are not going
supplies, materials, or equipment provided backed by American money and guns. in there. The newspapers said the other
to, for, or on behalf.of Cambodia but in no The Joint Chiefs have been very can- day that they have doubled the amount
case less than 331/3 per centum of the amount did in the newspaper-I do not know ? of military advisers in Pnompenh. The
the United States paid at, the time such whether they intended to be or not- Senator from New Jersey has been trying
goods, supplies, materials, or equipment were' but they are intending to build an army to get a personnel limit. I support his
acquired by the United States. of more than 300,000 Cambodians. efforts.
That sounds fair and proper to me. I assume they are doing the same in I just want to make my position clear.
Mr. STENNIS. That language indicates Laos, because they have asked for a I am not arguing about $15 million or
the principle that I am maintaining for, similar vast increase in Laos; and, of $20 million. I am arguing about the
I am not certain about that 331/3 percent. course, Thailand is our bastion country, policy of this country in undertaking an
I understand that is a reasonable ground into which we have poured billions of endless operation in Southeast Asia to
rule. dollars and will continue to do so. build up huge military forces there.
Mr. SYMINGTON. There is no use in I do not know why it is not legitimate I think it is against the President's
passing any legislation limiting the for the Senate to take the responsibility: announced policy. of going to Peking,
amount of money but then having the Do we want to go down that road again? and I think it is against the interests of
Defense Dee p ft- rkd ?*12dWi 1 9 s Wi, 4 81600 9WW0
 Approved For Release 2005/11/21: CIA-RDP73B00296R000500040030-0
S 17172 CONGRESSIONAL. RECORD -- SENATE October 29, 1971
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, will
the Senator yield?
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I will yield for a
'question.
Mr. President, how much time do I
have remaining?
- Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, I
do not know when this unanimous-
consent agreement was entered into, and
ask unanimous consent for an additional
10 minutes.
Mr. MANSFIELD. Mr. President, I
must object, because the time was avail-
able this morning, and that is when part
of the time was lost. But I would sug-
gest that 10 minutes be taken out of the
bill.
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield 5 minutes
from the bill to the Senator from
Missouri.
Does the Senator from New Jersey
wish some time? .
Mr. CASE. I would like 2 minutes.
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, how
much time do I have on the amendment?
The PRESIDING OFFICER. One
minute.
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I.yield that minute
plus 5 minutes on the bill to the Senator
from Missouri.
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, I
would not want the Senate to misunder-
stand the basic purpose of this perfect-
ing amendment.
What we want to do is establish con-
trol of the vast amounts of money being
spent in the Far East. I think it fair to
say Congress has lost control of the ex-
penditure of that money. This amend-
ment would now give the administration
all the money they say they needed In
Cambodia for next year; but before they
spend any additional money, it will be.
necessary for them to come back and ob-
tain additional authorization.
If anyone believes this amount is too
much, that can be brought up when the
matter comes to the Senate for appro-
priation approval, or, prior to that, for
same when it comes before the Appro-
priations Committee.
In my opinion the Chairman of the
Committee on Armed Services has been
quite fair with respect to this proposed
legislation. It is probable that we would
not be able to adopt this amendment if
he had not agreed we should establish
control if the administration wants ad-
ditional money.
Therefore, and with the premise that
we will have a chance to get into this
matter at the time the Senate approves
appropriations, I will vote for the per-
fecting amendment which I have sent to
the desk.
Mr, CASE. Mr. President, will the Sen-
ator from Arkansas yield?
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I' yield 3 minutes to
the Senator from New Jersey.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen-
ator from New Jersey is recognized for 3
minutes.
Mr. CASE. Mr. President, although I
have worked with,the. Senator from Mis-
souri on this amendment, on which we
are cosponsors. and I fully respect his
made no such commitment. I fully sup-
port the action of the committee on this
particular matter which is to support
adoption of the Symington committee
amendment for the $250 million ceiling
for the fiscal year and a 200 personnel
limitation in the same amendment. The,
$250 million represents roughly the cur-
rent rate of American assistance. On the
same premise as that just now urged by
the Senator from Missouri, I urge that
we keep it at the present rate while we
are considering the whole question of our
obligation and the depth of our commit-
ment in this new area. It has only been
a year and a half since we have gotten
into this particular situation. We got into
-it without congressional approval, wholly
on the basis of the discretionary funds
used by the administration. It was later
approved, it .is true, when we considered
the supplemental appropriation bill last
year, but it was approved on the basis of
a much smaller amount than this year,
an amount adequate to take care of the
current level operation which I think is,
if anything, excessive-$250 million.
However, it should remain the same and
I urge the Senate to turn down this pro-
posed increase of $91 million in this area.
The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. BYRD
of Virginia). All time has now expired.
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I send
an amendment to the desk in the nature
of a substitute to the pending.amend-
ment.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The
amendment will be stated.
The legislative clerk read as follows:
On page 44, lines 13 and 14, strike out the
words "in excess of $150 million.".
On page 44, beginning with "In" on line
20, strike out everything down through and
including "any" on line 23, and insert in lieu
thereof "No",
On page 44, line 24, insert immediately
after "equipment" the words "shall be".
On page 44, line 26, strike out "such" and
insert immediately after "year" the date
"1972".
On page 45, strike out everything on lines
1 through 6 and everything on lines 16
through 19.
On pages 45 and 40 redesignate paragraphs
(e), (f), and (g) as paragraphs (d), (e), and
(f), respectively.
The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr.
BYRD of Virginia). The Chair will say
that the amendment offered by the Sena-
tor from Alaska is not in order, that it
is not a valid substitute, and does not
amend the same place in the bill as the
amendment offered by the Senator from
Missouri.
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I suggest
the absence of a quorum for a brief
moment-I withdraw that request, Mr.
President,
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I
yield myself 2 minutes on the bill to
clarify?the situation.
Mr. President, I was told by the Sena-
tor from Alaska that all he wished to do
was to change the amount in the amend-
ment of the Senator from Missouri from
the $341 million to $150 million. It is as
simple as that. So that I do not under-
stand why it is not in order. It was sent
Senator from Missouri from $341 to $150
million. The Senator from Alaska has
a right to do that, and, of course, from
my point of view, I shall support it be-
cause I do not approve of an increase
In the amount as offered in the amend-
ment of the Senator from Missouri.
The Senator from Alaska told me what
he wanted to do, that he wanted to
change the amount to $150 million. I do
not understand why it is not in order.
The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr.
BYRD of Virginia). The Chair will say
that the amendment offered by the Sen-
ator from Missouri affects two places in
the bill. The amendment offered by the
Senator from Alaska affects five different
places, including a different page of the
bill,
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I have
sent another copy of a perfecting amend-
ment to the desk which I would ask the
Parliamentarian to rule on its accepta-
bility to the amendment of the Senator
from Missouri.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The
clerk will report the perfecting amend-
ment.
The legislative clerk read as, follows:
On page 44, lines 13 and 14, strike out the
words "in excess of $250 million" and insert
"$150 million."
The PRESIDING OFFICER, The
amendment is in order.
Who yields time?
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President-
The PRESIDING OFFICER. How
much times does the Senator require?
Mr. GRAVEL. As much time as I may
need to make my introductory remarks,
and then I will be happy to yiel i to other
Senators who may wish to address them-
selves to this same issue.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen-
ator from Alaska may proceed.
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, my orig-
inal amendment was to eliminate all
money for Cambodia. This is not new..I
offered a similar one last year, along with
several of my colleagues; but we were
not successful last year.
I am totally distressed over the fact
that this body chooses to escalate our in-
volvement-and I use the word "esca-
late" because I have heard it mentioned
here that we are treading water and
keeping the same commitment we had
last year. That is not the case. Members
should be on notice that we are escalat-
ing, that we are not treading water.
It seems unlikely that we could garner
enough support from the membership to
secure passage of my original amend-
ment, so at the request of the Senator
from Arkansas I am happy to modify my
amendment to leave out the bombing
provision and to permit a modicum
amount for cleanup operations. We could
try at least to rehabilitate the country
and leave it in a semblance of the state
in which we found it. That is the reason
I have gone along with the $150 million.
The $150 million is still treading
Water, but not the $250 million.
As I recall the incidents last year, we
went into Cambodia on a unilateral de-
cision, without the permission of Con-
those who th n ps n ent money to the tune of
"ing that money from aid
~r ".
chance to v2 &
ment, I am under no such obligation. I the amount in the amendment of the that would have gone to other countries..
 October 'kip. 9y~d For Rele j9M& ZJNAk -
What came before this body last De-
cember was a piece of legislation to put
back the money the President had spent-
unilaterally, robbing various aid pro-
grams to do so. The amount was first $100
million. Then the request was for $150
million; so, thus far, what has been spent
in Cambodia, in excess of 1 year, has been
$250 million.
What was agreed to, before the fact,
was $150 million. Now we are asked to
agree, before the fact, to $250 million.,.
If that is not escalation, then ob-
viously-
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, if
the Senator from Alaska will yield on
that point, the Senator from Missouri's
perfecting amendment makes it $341 mil-
lion. Actually, the $250 million is what
the committee bill provides and then yes-
terday the McGee amendment was sug-
gested and voted down, which would have
lifted any ceiling at all. The Senator from
Missouri, as he has stated, had the un-
derstanding of the Senator from Mis-
sissippi (Mr. STENNIS) that we would
change this amount today to $341 mil-
lion. The Senator from Alaska would be
cutting-the $341 million back to $150
million.
Mr. GRAVEL. That is right.
Mr. FULBRIGHT. The issue is sim-
ple: Do we want to increase the amount
of money to Cambodia to build up a large
army, which we will have to support, or
do we wish to stabilize at a lower level?
These amounts are simply a symbol of
a policy. I would hope the Senate would
not go on record as saying it is in favor
of, in effect, of letting the administration
do whatever it deems proper in Cam-
bodia and in Laos. I do not understand
how this can be interpreted as a re-
straint. It is for 1 year. Next year they
will say, "We want $550 million." And
the year after they will want $800 mil-
lion, and we will have to have a ceiling
of $800 million.
The Senator from Alaska is trying to
cut back by about $200 million, when
judged against the $341 million being of-
fered by the Senator from Missouri. I
think that is a very simple proposition.
The substitute amendment of the Sena-
tor from Alaska draws attention not only
to money, but also to policy.
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I ask that
the amendment be modified as identified
by the Parliamentarian.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The
amendment is accordingly modified.
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, will
the Senator yield?
Mr. GRAVEL. I yield.
Mr.. SYMINGTON. Mr. President,
again I hope that the Senate does not
get the wrong impression about the basic
thrust of the position some of us are
taking on this measure. It did not make
any real difference what the figure is
that was approved by the Foreign Rela-
tions Committee or passed by the Senate
in the past, the administration has spent
the money the way they wanted and to
the amount they desired. Let me repeat,
the basic thrust of this amendment, is to
get some control.
One time a man told his attorney,
"When I die, I will leave my wife $1
Approved
)8002?0040030-0
His lawyer said "You haven't $1
million: '
The man said, "I know, but it will look
great in the papers."
That is the type and character of op-
eration we have been conducting around
here. It has been going on for years. It
ought to stop. Our limitations of money
may have looked great in the papers, but
at times they have no practical meaning.
Whatever the Congress authorizes is
all of the money that should be spent by
the administration.
For those who think that this is too
much money-and I am one of them-
there will be a full chance to analyze the
matter in coming days and weeks as to
how much should be reduced.
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I would
hope that the Senator would join me in
my amendment. If he feels that the
money being spent is too much, let us
say that it is too much and not go any
further.
Mr. SYMINGTON. Mr. President, the
Senator and I have discussed this matter.
He has come in, with a heavy reduction.
If we get control, later we can determine
the amount of money. Without control,
we are talking to the winds.
. Mr. GRAVEL. How would that give us
control? If we say $500 million, what
will stop them from spending $500
million?
Mr. SYMINGTON. The Senator ap-
parently has not read the amendment,
or the bill as it came from the Foreign
Relations Committee.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, would
the Senator yield me 5 minutes of his
time so that I might discuss the matter?
Mr. MANSFIELD. Mr. President, I had
asked the distinguished ranking minor-
ity member of the committee to yield
me 3 minutes for the same purpose.
Mr. AIKEN. Mr. President, I would be
glad to yield time to the Senator from
Montana. However, first I would like to
clear up any misunderstanding that may
exist. The State Department is in favor
of the Symington proposal to increase
funds to $341 million. I am sure of that.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, would
the Senator from Vermont yield me 5
minutes after he has yielded time to the
Senator from Montana?
Mr. AIKEN. Yes. Mr. President, I yield
3 minutes to the Senator from Montana.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen-
ator from Montana is recognized for 3
minutes.
Mr. MANSFIELD. Mr. President, when
President Nixon recognized the govern-
ment of Prince Norodom Sihanouk, he
dispatched two men to the embassy-it
was not a legation at the time-to repre-
sent us. In the interim, when Sihanouk
was overthrown, there were nine mem-
bers of our military-I do. not believe
they were attached to the military mis-
sion in Phnom Penh. Today there are in
excess of 150 civilian and military per-
sonnel, with the military in the prepond-
erance.,
Not so many days ago, there appeared
in the public prints an outline of a 5-
year aid plan for Cambodia, `I think esti-
mating in 1975 or 1976 an increase in
S 171'i
lieve $700,000, which is a higher figure
than mentioned by the chairman of the
Foreign Relations Committee, and at the
same time increasing the cost of the par-
ticipation to us.
I did not vote for the Case-Symington
amendment in committee. I have not
voted for an amendment on the floor,
that I recall. And the reason I have not
voted, and will not vote, for either the
Gravel amendment, the substitute, or
the Symington amendment, is because to
do so in my opinion would be to place a
stamp of approval on our participation
in what we are doing in Cambodia not
only now, but also in the years ahead if
the programed outline bears any sem-
blance to the truth. That I will not join
in doing.
So, I want the RECORD to be clear. If it
were a clearcut, outright doing away with
all funds, I would vote for it. However, to
me $150 million is just the same as $341
million.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who
yields time?
Mr. AIKEN. Mr. President, I yield 5
minutes to the Senator from Mississippi.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, the
Senator and I have discussed this prob-
lem. This is the problem we had also in
the Laotian amendment. We settled that,
and I think we will get it sustained in
conference.
This is almost identical. Let us move
back a little. About 15 months ago we
were fighting in Cambodia. Our men were
fighting there and were getting killed.
The President of the United States or-
dered them in there. No one except a
foolish man-and he is certainly not a
foolish man-would have sent our men
there if he thought it was not necessary
In order to maintain our position and
protect our men.
This is altogether a different policy.
Our men are out of there now. Whoever
the men are that are fighting there, they
are not our boys. However, this country
is in jeopardy. They are having to fight
for their lives. It is still a question of
whether they will be able to survive.
So, what is this aid? Here it is broken
down. We have a breakdown of these
other countries.
This will be an absolute control. They
cannot spend more.
Of the $341 million, $240 million is for
military assistance. About two-thirds of
it goes for ammunition and spare parts
and about one-third of it goes for various
other equipment.
My guess is that about half of that
equipment, at least, is secondhand equip-
ment, something that we have already
used. It is valued according to the forinu-
la to which the Senator referred.
The next item is economic aid, $110
million. That is an item in this amend-
ment. That is big AID,'$10 million, eco-
nomic aid. There is no military and no
Department of Defense. The Senator
from Arkansas gets excited about that
sometimes.
This is a program that comes from the
Foreign Relations Committee. Public Law
480, food for peace, $20 million.
the military from $35,000 at the time Excess defense articles, that is some
be- million.
I
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 S 171 74 Approved For Rel"b& ~t' (3&ik9IiC k IlQ?0i Qq( 500040030-?etobe7? 29, .1971
The total is $341 million. That is the Committee on Foreign Relations has Mr. GRAVEL. That is correct. I want
estimate of about what would be needed. pointed to the fact that there may be to emphasize that the word "ceiling" in
I have already explained about the some relaxation of tensions, attributable my opinion is a misnomer.
ammunition and the spare parts. I think in part to the President's forthcoming Mr. BROOKE. I am sorry. I did not
at this stage we have no valid choice visit to Moscow and Peking, and he has understand the Senator.
except to affirm these figures, as the Sen- referred to the fact that the situation is Mr. GRAVEL. It is a misnomer. I do
ator from Missouri who is well versed in better in South Vietnam. The situation not think it will work. I? have not seen
this matter has proposed, and we will is better in South Vietnam, but the si'tua- any ceiling in this body work.
let this matter ride on with an actual tion is better; because we helped the If this body had some of the sharing
ceiling on it. They cannot spend any more South Vietnamese build up an army ca-- of responsibility we talk about we could
than that and in that way we have es- pable of defending itself while we have end this cottonpicking war. The infer-
tablished legislative control on how been withdrawing. The situation has not ence was made that the invasion was by
much will be spent in this country for improved, because of any change in at- North Vietnam. The invasion of Cam-
all purposes, including this used military ? titude on the part of the North Viet- bodia took place by this country. I hope
equipment. So it is on. that basis we are namese. that would be made clear.
trying to get this as a practical matter. If we help the Cambodians. defend When we hear a government that talks
I commend the Senator for his willing- themselves, we are acting in our own in- of sterile democracy which it is going
ness to settle this on a reasonable, prac- terest, particularly if we recall that we to put aside, and we see a program by
tical basis. We follow next year from this have sorhe treaty obligations to such this administration to escalate, let us
starting point and we will have control countries as Thailand. go over the arithmetic again.
on it. The distinguished majority leader Last year the President, when we uni-
Mr. President, I hope the amendment spoke in terms of Sihanouk being "over- laterally invaded Cambodia, submitted
of the Senator from Alaksa is rejected thrown." I do not know what he means a figure of $100 million and all we did
and that the amendment of the Senator by the word "overthrown," but I am sure was approve it. Along with that request,
from Missouri is agreed to. he did not mean to leave the impression to pay back Peter who had been. robbed
. Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, I ask for that.Sihanouk was not replaced in the by Paul, was another $150 million that
the yeas and nays. regular manner. In fact, Lon Nol was put was approved by this body. Now, we are
The yeas and nays were ordered. in power in the same way that Sihanouk asked by the administration, by the com-
Mr. GRAVEL. Mr. President, how came to power, and as I understand it, mittee, for $250 million, which is an
much time remains on each side? the very people Sihanouk appointed re- escalation of $100 million more than we.,
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- placed Sihanouk and put Lon Nol in. approved last year, and we are asked
ator from Alaska has 3 minutes remain- That does not mean that I necessarily to go to $300 million carte blanche.
ing. . agree with the form or composition of Mr. CASE. Mr. President, will the Sen-
Mr. GRAVEL. How much time is re- the government there as now constituted. ator yield?
maining to the Senator from Arkansas? But that is really not the question. Mr. GRAVEL. I yield.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- Mr. President, I urge that the Gravel Mr. CASE. Mr. President, I intend to
ator from Arkansas has 5 minutes re- amendment be rejected and that the support the Senator on this amendment,
maining. Symington amendment be approved. but I protest against the suggestion that
Who yields time? Mr. BROOKE. Mr. President, will the what we are doing here is an exercise in
Mr. GRIFFIN. Mr. President, the dis- Senator from Alaska yield for a ques- futility. For the first time this will put
tinguished chairman of the Armed Serv- tion? an absolute ceiling, not on appropriations
ices Committee has made the case very Mr. GRAVEL. I ha\'e only a few min- but on spending. For all purposes it over-
well. However, I cannot allow the REc- utes remaining. Will the Senator from rides all provisions for discretionary
oao to stand with out answering a re- Arkansas yield? authority, transfers, or anything else;
mark made by the distinguished chair- The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- and I do not want any legislative history
man of the Committee on Foreign Re- ator from Vermont is yielding time on to be on the books which would give
lations to the effect that assitance for the bill. the chance for any executive agency to
Cambodia in line with the budget re- Mr. AIKEN. Mr. President, how much say this was not intended to be an ab-
quest would actually go against the pol- time do we have remaining? solute ceiling on spending of all kinds.
icy of the administration or the Presi- The PRESIDING OFFICER. There Mr. GRAVEL. My colleague has been
dent, are 2 minutes remaining to the Senator here much longer than I, and I would
The President's policy is to withdraw from Arkansas who has the opposition defer to his judgment, but I have been
American troops s rapidly as practicable time on the amendment, and 3 min- disillusioned in my tenure here.
from that part of the world. His policy utes remaining to the Senator from Mr. CASE. Of course, but we have done
is that U.S. troops should not be used Alaska. this before and in supporting the Sen-
to defend every threatened country; his Mr. FULBRIGHT. Does the Senator ator's amendment I want to be very clear
policy is to encourage such other coup- from Massachusetts wish me to yield 2 that we are not intending in any way
tries to bear the primary responsibility minutes? to leave any of those loopholes which
for defending themselves. Mr. BROOKE. Yes. have existed still in effect.
But the Nixon doctrine does not mean Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I Mr. GRAVEL. I realize that is the good.
that we have abandoned all our friends in yield 2 minutes to the Senator from faith of my colleague.
the world or that we have abandoned all Massachusetts. ? Mr. CASE. Not only good faith, but
non-Communist nations that want to re- The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- action by this body. We are not intend-
aggression. There are re two main parts ator from Massachusetts is recognized. ing to leave any discretionary authority
sist
si doctrine. One two main BROOKE. I wish to ask if the to transfer from one fund to another
of the
end .Senator from Alaska broke down the or anything of that sort, and I hope the
that we will help our friends defend is
themselves. amount of money into . items he would Senator will not leave the suggestion
recover by the $150 million he proposes that he intends it.
There is no question that what is go- to reduce it to?
ing on in Cambodia is not a civil war. Mr. GRAVEL. No, not the slightest. I
There has been some argument about Mr. GRAVEL. No, I have no break- endorse my colleague's statement 110
whether the war in South Vietnam is a down. percent.
civil war. In Cambodia it is out and out Mr. BROOKE. The Senator cut the I have -found as we close loopholes,
aggression by North Vietnam. In Cam- total sum and it is not broken down, as down the street they open them just as .
bodia the Cambodians want to defend the Senator from Mississippi indicated, fast. They prosecute the war regardless
themselves and they are defending them- Mr. GRAVEL. No. of what we say, regardless of demon-
selves Our policy is to help them, but Mr. BROOKE. It puts a ceiling on the strated facts on our part.
without providing any of our troops to total amount and reduces it to $150 mil- I hope this will be a firm reduction and
do the fighting. . lion without regard to how it shall be that my amendment will be agreed to,
The disti uished c fix an of the 0011/21 because it would do what Members of
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October 29, 1971 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD -SENATE
the Senate have said they want done:
Tread water. But to increase beyond $150
million is not treading water, and every
one should understand it is an escalation
of our activity in Cambodia.
Mr. CASE. Mr. President, will the Sen-
ator yield?
Mr. GRAVEL. I yield.
Mr. CASE. The point of my protest
before about use of the suggestion that
this is just an idle gesture, is given spe-
cial support by this newspaper report
which said that the Joint Chiefs of Staff
had proposed four ways to get around
any ceiling over spending-or any lim-
itation, rather, not a ceiling on spend-
ing-which is what we are doing-but
to get around any limitation on author-
ization in this bill. It is for that reason
that it is terribly important that we not
only have a limitation on authorizations,
which we have, but this ceiling, which
would be on the spending.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, will the
Senator yield?
Mr. GRAVEL. I yield.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time
has expired on the amendment.
Mr. MANSFIELD. Mr. President, I
yield 1 minute on the bill,
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, I have
no doubt about it. This is an actual ceil-
ing. This is a limitation on expenditures.
It was our committee which dug in and
dug out to get the figures and required
the report. We know what the expendi-
tures are going to be. We know what the
program is. We know what are the used
goods and the evaluations put on them.
Have no doubt about it-this Is an actual
ceiling and .an actual limitation.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The ques-
tion is on agreeing to the perfecting
amendment of the Senator from Alaska
to the amendment of the Senator from
Missouri. The yeas and nays have been
ordered, and the clerk will call the roll.
The legislative clerk called the roll.
Mr. MANSFIELD (after having voted
In the negative). Mr. President, on this
vote I have a pair with the Senator from
Louisiana (Mr. ELLENDER). If he were
present and voting, he would vote "yea."
If I were at liberty to vote, I would vote
"nay." Therefore, I withdraw my vote.
Mr. BYRD of West Virginia. I an-,
nounce that the Senator from Louisiana
(Mr. ELLENDER), the Senator from
Georgia (Mr. GAMBRELL), the Senator
from Oklahoma (Mr. HARRIS), the Sen-
ator from Indiana (Mr. HARTKE), the
Senator from Hawaii (Mr. INOUYE), the
Senator from Washington (Mr. JACK-
sox), the Senator from Massachusetts
(Mr. KENNEDY), the Senator from Wyo-
ming (Mr, MCGEE), the Senator from
South Dakota (Mr. MCGOVERN), and the
Senator from Maine (Mr. MusKIE) are
necessarily absent.
I further announce that if present and
voting, the Senator from 'Washington
(Mr. JACKSON) would vote "nay."
I further announce that, if present
and voting, the Senator from Massachu-
setts (Mr. KENNEDY) . and the Senator
from South Dakota (Mr. MCGOVERN)
would vote "yea."
Mr. GRIFFIN. I announce that the
Senators from Nebraska (Mr. CURTIS and
Mr. HRUSKA), the Senator from Idaho
(Mr. JORDAN), the Senator from Iowa
(Mr. MILLER), the Senator from Ohio
(Mr. TAFT), and the Senator from Texas
(Mr. TOWER) are necessarily absent.
The Senator from South Dakota (Mr.
MUNDT) is absent because of illness.
The Senator from South Carolina (Mr.
THURMOND) is absent on official business.
The Senator from Vermont (Mr. STAr-
FoRD) , and the Senator from Connecticut
(Mr. WEICKER) are detained on official
business.
If present and voting, the Senators
from Nebraska (Mr. CURTIS and Mr.
HRUSKA), the Senator from Vermont (Mr.-
STAFFORD), the Senator from Ohio (Mr.
TAFT). the Senator fro, n South Carolina
(Mr. THuRMoND) and the Senator from
Texas (Mr. Towzn) would each vote
"nay,
The result was announced-yeas 26,
nays 53, as follows:
[No. 279 Leg.]
YEAS-26
Bayh Gravel Nelson
Brooke Hart Fell
Burdick Hatfield Proxmire
Byrd, W. Va.- Hughes Randolph
Case Mathias Ribicoff
Church Metcalf Schwelker
Cotton Mondale Tunney
Cranston Montoya Williams
Fulbright Moss
NAYS-53
Aiken Dole McIntyre
Allen Dominick Packwood
Allott Eagleton Pastore
Anderson Eastland Pearson
Baker Ervin Percy
Beall Fannin Roth
Bellmon Fong Saxbe
Bennett Goldwater Scott
Bentsen Griffin Smith
Bible Gurney Sparkman
Boggs Hansen Spong
Brock Hollings Stennis
Buckley Humphrey Stevens
Byrd, Va. Javits Stevenson
Cannon Jordan, N,0. Symington
Chiles Long Talmadge
Cook Magnuson Young
Cooper . McClellan
PRESENT AND GIVING A LIVE PAIR, AS
PREVIOUSLY RECORDED-1
Mansfield, against.
Curtis Jackson Muskie
Ellender Jordan, Idaho Stafford
Gambrell, Kennedy Taft
Harris McGee Thurmond
Hartke McGovern Tower
Hruska Miller Weicker
'Inouye Mundt
So Mr. GRAVEL'S amendment was re-
jected.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The ques-
tion is on agreeing to the -amendment
offered by the Senator from Missouri. All
time on the amendment has expired.
The yeas and nays have been ordered,
and the clerk'will call the roll.
The legislative clerk called the roll.
Mr. PAS`I'ORE (after having voted in
the affirmative). On this vote I have a
live pair with the Senator from Louisiana
(Mr. ELLENDER). If he were present and
voting, he would vote "nay." I have al-
ready voted "yea." I therefore withdraw
my vote, as an accommodation to the
Senator from Louisiana.
Mr. BYRD of West Virginia. I an-
nounce that the Senator from Louisiana
(Mr. ELLENDER), the Senator from
Georgia (Mr. GAMBRELL), the Senator
from Oklahoma (Mr. HARRIS), the Sena-,
S 17175
for from Indiana (Mr. HARTKE), the
Senator from Hawaii (Mr. INOUYE), the
Senator from Washington (Mr. JACK-
SON), the Senator from Massachusetts
(Mr. KENNEDY), the Senator from Wyo-
ming (Mr. MCGEE), the Senator from
South Dakota (Mr. McGovERN), and. the
Senator from Maine (Mr. Musxlz) are
necessarily absent.
I further announce that, if present
and voting, the Senator from Washington
(Mr. JACKSON) would vote "yea."
.I further announce that if present and
voting, the Senator from Massachusetts
(Mr. KENNEDY) would vote "nay."
Mr. GRIFFIN. I announce that the
Senators from Nebraska (Mr. CURTIS and
Mr. HRUSKA), the Senator from Idaho
(Mr. JORDAN), the Senator from Iowa
(Mr. MILLER), the Senator from Ohio
(Mr. TArT), and the Senator from Texas
(Mr. TOWER) are necessarily absent.
The Senator from South Dakota (Mr.
MUNDT) is absent because of illness.
The Senator from South Carolina
(Mr. THURMOND) is absent on official
business.
If present and voting, the Senators
from Nebraska (Mr. CURTIS and Mr.
HRUSKA), the Senator from, Ohio. (Mr.
TAFT), the Senator from South Carolina
(Mr. THURMOND), and the Senator from
Texas (Mr. TOWER) would each vote
The result was announced-yeas 45,
nays 36, as follows:
[No. 280 Leg.]
YEAS--45
Aiken
Dole
Percy
Allott
Dominick
Randolph
Baker
Eastland
Roth
Beall
Fannin
Saxbe
Bellmon
Fong
Scott
Bennett
Goldwater
Smith
Bentsen
Griffin
Sparkman
Bible
Gurney
Spong
Boggs
Hansen
Stafford
Brock
Hollings
Stennis
Buckley
Long
Stevens
Byrd, Va.
Magnuson
Symington
Byrd, W. Va.
McIntyre
Talmadge
Cannon
Packwood
Tunney
Cook
Pearson
Young
NAYS-36
Allen
Ervin
Metcalf
Anderson
Fulbright
Mondale
Bayh
Gravel
Montoya
Brooke
Hart
Moss
Burdick
Hatfield
Nelson
Case
Hughes
Poll
Chiles
Humphrey
Proxmire
Church
Javits
Ribicofl
Cooper
Jordan, N.C.
Schweiker
Cotton
Mansfield
Stevenson
Cranston
Mathias
Weicker
Eagleton .
McClellan
Williams
PRESENT AND GIVING A LIVE PAIR, AS
PREVIOUSLY RECORDED-I
Pastore, for.
NOT VOTING---I8
Curtis
Inouye
Miller
Ellender
Jackson
Mundt
Gambrell
Jordan, Idaho
Muskie
Harris
Kennedy
Taft
'.Hartke
McGee
Thurmond
Hruska
McGovern
Tower
ci So ,Mr. SYMINGTON'S amendment was
agreed to.
. Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, I move
that the vote by which the amendment
was agreed to be reconsidered.
Mr. PASTORE. Mr. President, I move
to lay that motion on the, table.
The motion to lay on the table was
agreed to. -
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 Approved For Release 2005/11/21: CIA-RDP 029 00040030-0
S 17196 CONGRESSIONAL REC - October 29, T 9?1
The result was announced-yeas
nays 52, as follows:
[No. 282 Leg.]
YEAS-28
amendment affecting page 34 of the bill, Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, as I have,
which is at the desk, understood, now, the Senator proposes
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The that in section 513 on page 34 of the
amendment will be stated. bill, the words "South Vietnam, Cam-
The legislative clerk proceeded to read bodia, and Burma" be stricken out of
the amendment. lines 13 and 14, as they appear.
Mr. CASE. Mr. President, I ask unani- Mr. CASE. That is right.
mous consent that further reading of the Mr. STENNIS. That would leave, of
amendment be dispensed with, and that course, then, the words "Laos, North
the amendment be printed in the RECORD. Vietnam, and Thailand," as they appear
The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without now in the bill.
objection, it is so ordered. And, without Mr. President, the Senator from New
objection, even though the amendment Jersey has correctly stated the under-
of the Senator from Idaho is the pend- standing that we have- had about this
ing business, the Senate will proceed to legislation, and we have agreed, for the
consider the amendment of the Senator purpose of this legislative step, that this
Allen
Cook
Jordan, N.C.
Aliott
Dole
Jordan, Idaho
Baker
Dominick
McClellan
Bennett
Eastland
Smith
Bible
Ervin
Stennis
Brock
Fannin
Stevens
Buckley
Fong
Talmadge
Byrd, Va.
Gurney
Young
Byrd, W. Va.
Hansen
Cannon
Hollings
NAYS-62
Aiken
Hatfield
Percy
Anderson
Humphrey ?
Proxmire
Bayh
Javits
Randolph
Beall
Kennedy
Ribicofi
Bellmon
Long
Roth
Bentsen
Magnuson
Saxbe
Boggs
Mansfield
Schweiker
Brooke
Mathias
Scott
Burdick
McIntyre
Sparkman
Case
Metcalf
Spong
Chiles
Mondale
Stafford
Church
Montoya
Stevenson
Cooper
Moss
Symington
Cranston
Nelson
Taft
Fulbright
Packwood
Weicker
Griffin
Pastore
Williams -
Harris -
Pearson
Hart
Pell
NOT VOTING-20
Cotton
Hartke
Miller
Curtis
Hruska
Mundt
Eagleton
Hughes
Muskie
Ellender
Inouye
Thurmond
Gambrell
Jackson
Tower
McGee
y
Gravel
McGovern
from New Jersey.
Mr. CASE'S amendment is as follows:
On page 34, lines 13 and 14, strike out
"South Vietnam, North Vietnam, Thailand,
Cambodia, or Burma" and insert in lieu
thereof "North Vietnam, or Thailand".
Mr. CASE. I thank the Senator from
Idaho for his consideration, and, pursu-
ant to my assurance, I shall delay him
only slightly, I am sure there will be no
difficulty about this amendment.
Mr. President, on page 34 of the bill,
the committee added a provision to the
effect that no funds authorized or appro-
priated under any provision of law should
be made available by means of any offi-
cer, employee, or agency of the United
States to finance military operations by
So Mr. DOMINICK'S amendment was re,
jetted.
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I
move to reconsider the vote by which the
amendment was rejected.
section
t
lks
.
a
+6
tion on the table. the Armed Services Committee an ex-
The motion to lay on the table was pression of concern about the breadth Mr. STENNIS. No, I am talking about
agreed to. of this amendment, and after discus- the same section. I think that leaving the
Mr. CHURCH. Mr. President, I send sions with him, we have arrived at the word "Laos" in the bill as now written is
to the desk an amendment, and ask for understanding that- perhaps a contradiction of a provision
its immediate consideration. Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, will the on the same subject in the military pro-
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair maintain order? I think this is an curement bill we passed 21/2 weeks ago.
amendment will be stated. important matter, and the Senator ought However, I think that to get all the real
The legislative clerk read as follows: to be heard, in view of a possible agree- facts on this matter before the Senate
On page 32, line 11, strike out "$565,000,- ment on the floor. now would require a closed session. There
000" and insert in lieu thereof "$462,000,000". The PRESIDING order. T CE R. The Sen- is think hardly there is time for any that mood nowfor, it, and I either, do not
, So,
Mr. BYRD of West Virginia. Mr.. ate will be in order. The Senator will suspend his remarks until order has as an original proposition, and without
President, may we have order? been restored. prejudice, we agreed to let this matter go
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- as has already been outlined, and then
ate will be in order. The Senator may proceed. in conference there will be a chance to
Mr. CASE. Mr. President, will the Sen- Mr. CASE. Mr. President, the chair- really consider and discuss any facts
ator yield? ' nian of the Armed Services Committee, that might be relevant; and I would
Mr. CHURCH. Mr. President, in order the distinguished Senator from Missis- , . rest on the decision that is made by the
to accommodate three Senators, the Sen- sippi (Mr. STENNIS) and I have dis ,,conferees.
ator from New Jersey (Mr. CASE), the cussed this matter. His concern about Under those circumstances, I hope
Senator from Arkansas (Mr. FULBRIGHT), the number of countries affected by the that the modification will be acceptable
and the Senator from Mississippi (Mr. amendment as reported by our commit-, to the Senate. I have talked with some
STENNIS), I have agreed to yield briefly, tee was one that I recognized with re- Senators about supporting my position in
with the consent of the Senate, provided spect. Pursuant to an understanding that this matter, and I now withdraw the re-
I do not lose my right to the floor. we have arrived at, I now offer this quest because I believe this meets the
[Disturbance in the galleries.] amendment to eliminate from the effect situation.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Gal- of the bill three of the six countries, Mr. CASE. Mr. President, I yield to
leries will be in order. The Sergeant at leaving in Laos, North Vietnam, and the chairman, if he wishes to make coin-
Arms will see that order in the galleries Thailand. That is the whole amendment. ment.
is restored. The Senator from Mississippi has been Mr. FULBRIGHT. I am in full agree-
The Chair recognizes the Senator from gracious enough to say that while 'he meat with that.
New Jersey. wants to consider this matter further at The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who
Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, may a later stage in the -legislation; for the yields time?
we have order? purposes of the consideration of the bill . Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, will the
The PRESIDING OFFICER: The Sen- in the Senate at this time, such an Senator yield me 1 minute?
ate will be in order.' amendment is satisfactory. . Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield.
M SENNS the -
The S0 ator from few Jersey mayr.TI....... "--- ,..__. ---- --- roceed. Approved For. Release 2o 0 tb2tieic DP73B00296R0005O( 3'4"$(, - onsider this an important
_. - __ - - ,- --- -,- ,,,.4+4- ar at T a.m free to follow it
foreign forces in six countries-Laos,
South Vietnam, North Vietnam, Thai-
land, Cambodia, or Burma- unless Con-
gress specifically authorizes the use of
such funds for that purpose, and desig-
nates the area where they will be used.
modification of section 513 will put the
section where it may stay in the bill in
that form, and we can move forward with
the bill without any further amendment
being filed or brought up by the Senator
from Mississippi.
I do make the point, as the Senator
has implied, that this is done without
prejudice to a full consideration of the
matter in conference, based on the facts
as they may exist at that time.
Is that the Senator's understanding?
Mr. CASE. The Senator has stated
correctly what his position is, and the
basis on which his agreement not to op-
pose this amendment or to offer another
amendment to this section is based.
Mr. STENNIS. I thank the Senator,
and I wish to make this further explana-
tion: I think leaving the word "Laos"
in here-
Mr. CASE. That is another section.
Mr. STENNIS. I beg the Senator's
pardon?
 October 29, 4i rr'eved For Rule i iti 3ROREB13002:WRQQ0500040030-0
up
as is the Senator f
N
,
rom
ew Jersey ati f thii
,cngore mnorty leader? Does the
of course, or anyone else-the chairman minority leader yield back the remainder
of the committee or anyone else-and get of his time on this amendment?
the facts together and get it before the Mr. GRIFFIN. I yield back the remain-
conference. der of the time.
Mr. CASE. The situation is that the . The PRESIDING OFFICER. All
matter will be in conference, because the time on the amendment has been yielded
House bill does not contain any provi- back. The question is on agreeing to the
sion on this subject. amendment of the Senator from
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield back the re- Arkansas.
mainder of my time. -e The amendment was agreed to.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, I
on the amendment has been yielded back. have a technical amendment that does
The question is on agreeing to the not affect the bill at all, except to clear
amendment of the Senator from New
up a typographical e
rror.
Jersey, The PRESIDING OFFICER. The
The amendment was agreed to. amendment will be stated.
Mr. CHURCH addressed the Chair. The legislative clerk read as follows:
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- On page 20, line 18, after "1969,", insert
ator from Idaho, by unanimous consent, the following: "$350,00o,00o for the fiscal
yielded to three Senators in order, the year 1970, and".
first of those Senators being the Se-
r
at-from New Jersey. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Mr. MOSS. Mr. President, I ask the
objection, the amendment is in order. Chair to lay before the Senate a message
""~ Mr. FULBRIGHT. Mr. President, un-
der the agreement, I send an amend- Who yields time? from the House? of Representatives on
ment to the desk. Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield myself 1 S. 30.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The minute. The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr.
amendment will be stated. . Mr. President, this has no effect upon ALLEN) laid before the Senate the
a$The legislative clerk read as follows: the bill at all. It is a mistake, a typo- amendment of the House of Representa-
On page 34, line 4, strike out the words' graphical error, on the part of the staff tives to the bill (S. 30) to establish the
Laos, or South Vietnam." in preparing the bill. They did not make Arches National Park in the State of
errors, but is a har to Uh, which was to stke out
? The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without' eepystr
aight. Thishamendl en t hasl no he enacting clause, and inert:all after
objection, the amendment will be in. effect on anything substantive in the bill. That (a) subject to valid existing rights,
order. I yield back the remainder of my time. the lands, waters, and interests therein with-
Who yields time? Mr. GRIFFIN. I yield back the time. in the boundary generally depicted on the
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield myself 2 The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time map entitled 'Boundary Map, Proposed
minutes. on the amendment has been yielded back. Arches National Park, Utah," numbered
--20, 00113 Mr. President, this is exactly the same The question is on agreeing to the RP9, are3here est and dated the Arches
mSeptember
circumstance as the previous one, by. amendment of the Senator from Arkan- National ark, hereinafter ardto athagreement with the Senator from Mis- ") . Park, shall referred e the
sissippi. We have discussed this matter. The sas.. amendment was agreed to. Such p map shalbe nn file and
This involves the return to the Commit- . available for public inspection the offices
tee on Foreign Relations of Jurisdiction AMENDMENT NO. 54O of the National Park Service, , Department of
over military assistance to Laos, South ?Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, I send to the interior.
overnam and Thailand, the desk an amendment on which we re) The she , ches Nanoful s Monument it
have agreed. I do not think it will take hereby aboli shed, the and
availe beabavi il-
shall
We have agreed to strike out South more than a minute or minute and a able for purposes of the park. Federal lands,
Vietnam and Laos but to retain Thai-? half. waters
t
i
no
d
sagree, t may say, with the return object ionion, _.--- ` ,"on"' the y basis sis f ofUt, I have ultimately of the jurisdiction over Laos qualification the same
and South Vietnam, but he thinks it is qualification.
OFpI(
premature to put it in this bill at this The PRESIDING
meat
have agreed to this modification.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President, will the
Senator Yield?
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield to the Sena-
tor from Mississippi.
Mr. STENNIS. Mr. President the Sen_
the matter. Thailand is left in the bill; lne PRESIDING OFFICER. Without
and military assistance hereafter, if this Wjection, the amendment is in order.
becomes law, will be handled by the Com- Who yields time?
mittee on Foreign Relations. I am willing Mr. STENNIS. . I yield myself 1 min
that, in the future, jurisdiction with re- ute,
spect to Southeast Asia be returned to mint onrwhich twe worked out an agree-
the Committee on Foreign Relations. I ment with the Senator from Arkansas. It
think that while we are there and our relates to reports being made by the De-
men are there and the activities are
go- partment of Stt t
aeo the Committee on
fug on, we ought to keep it where it is, Foreign Relations, and we are in favor
because they have to be considered t
f
o- o
that The l
.anguage was so broad, how-
gether. I appreciate the Senator's 'ever, that we thought it would include
position.
With that, I am satisfied with the sec-
tion as modified.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who
yields time?
Mr. FULBRIGHT. I yield back the re- .
mainder of my time.
The PRESIDING OFFICER
i
vi
S fe 97
intention of the committee to usurp any
jurisdiction of the Armed Services Com-
mittee. This amendment clarifies the in-
tention of the committee.
I yield back the remainder of my time:
Mr. STE, NNIS. I yield back the re-
mainder of my time.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. All time
on the amendment has been yielded back.
The, question is on agreeing to the
amendment of the Senator from Mis-
sissippi.
-OThe amendment was agreed to.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. In ac-
cordance with the previous order, the
Chair recognizes the Senator from Utah
(Mr. Moss),
ESTABLISHMENT OF ARCHES NA-
inafter referred to as the "Secretary") in
accordance with the laws applicable to the
public lands of the United States.
The legislative clerk read as follows: ?,SEC., 2. The Secretary is authorized to ac-'
sibilities" insert the following words: "with- eralfagency, exchange ornotherwise, the lands
in the jurisdiction of these committees" a and i
t
,
n
erests
n y with the approval of such
State or political subdivision.
SEC. 3. Where any Federal lands included
within the park are legally occupied or util-
ized on the date of approval of this Act for
grazing purposes, pursuant to a lease, per-
mit, or license for a fixed term of years is-
sued or authorized by any department, es-
tablishment, or agency of the United States,
the Secretary of the Interior shall permit
the persons holding such grazing privileges
or their heirs to continue in the exercise
thereof during the term of the lease, permit,
or license, and one period of renewal there-
f+--
t
-
on Sze, 4. Nothing in this Act shall be con.
Armed Services has primary jurisdiction. strued as affecting in any way any rights of
These words merely correct and clarify owners and Operators of cattle and sheep
that point, and I hope the amendment herds, existing on the date immediately prior
will
will be adopted. to the enactment of this Act, to trail their
Mr. , b FULBRIGHT. Mr. President I herds on traditional courses used by them
such date of enactment
wish the REcoRD to show that that is t
, and to wa-
er that
or e~eas '2//reIPU286F~`Qt~ing the fact that
Approved
ails and watering
in-
sert the following words: "within the juris- terests therein owned by the State of Utah,
diction of these committees" or any political subdivision thereof, may be
acquired o 1
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