CONVERSATION WITH MR. DALE DE HAAN, COUNSEL, SENATE SUBCOMMITTEE ON REFUGEES AND ESCAPEES

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP74B00415R000200240006-4
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 2
• Document Creation Date: December 20, 2016
• Document Release Date: November 6, 2006
• Sequence Number: 6
• Publication Date: March 20, 1972
• Content Type: MFR

Approved For Release 2006/11/08: CIA-RDP74B00415R000200240006-4
INTERNAL USE ONLY
SUBJECT: Conversation with Mr. Dale de Haan, Counsel, Senate
Subcommittee on Refugees and Escapees
1. I called Dale de Haan today and asked if we could get a copy of
Senator Kennedy's press release covering the classified GAO report on the
refugee program in Laos. I did this on the pretext that Tad Szulc's column
in yesterday's New York Times contained a considerable distortion of the
facts as I knew them.
2. I pleaded ignorance as to the details of the AID program but told
him it had been my understanding that because of the concern which Senator
Kennedy expressed last year about benefit payments going to the dependents
of "guerrillas" in Laos from funds budgeted for AID we were reimbursing
AID for these amounts. I said I couldn't understand the apparent objection
expressed in the Szulc column to giving these dependents the same kind of
benefits accorded other Lao civilians merely because they were dependents
of men who were fighting for their country. I said it would appear this
amounted to discrimination against persons in a combatant role as opposed
to those who were doing little or nothing by comparison.
3. Mr. de Haan made a statement which he repeated several times
during our conversation to the effect there was no real objection to those
people receiving payments but they should not get them under the economic
aid program. He said several times that Senator Kennedy objected strongly
to "economic aid being used as a cover for payments to guerrillas. " I said
he was inferring in this statement that these payments were something in
the form of salary when in fact it was my understanding they were merely
the same type of benefit which was given to those Laotians who were not
involved in the fighting. Mr. de Haan argued these people were not refugees
and if they were to get payments they should get them under the military aid
u ~~ :` J l Y l~ 6.3 L
LY CPC. 10/22/2003
Approved For Release 2006/11/08: CIA-RDP74B00415R000200240006-4
 Approved For Release 2006/11E/08: I -R~DP74 415R000200240006-4
INTRNAL Oi
program and not under economic aid. When I asked de Haan what types of
people he considered as "refugees" he said everyone except the guerrillas
and their dependents. I said in my opinion he was describing civilians rather
than refugees and this definition made it even more plain that their position
amounted to discrimination against those people who were doing the actual
fighting in Laos.
4. Mr. de Haan said the program in Laos should be run the same way
it is run in Vietnam, i.e., benefits paid to military personnel paid under the
military aid program (openly, not under some type of cover). Using the
Szulc column as a frame of reference I said I could not understand the reaction
attributed to Senator Kennedy to the arrangement which was worked out because
of the objections expressed last year. Mr. de Haan argued that this problem
went back to 1962 when certain abuses were involved in the AID program and
they had been given assurances by AID the abuses would be corrected and
they had not been.
5. It was clear neither of us was going to convince the other of his
position but de Haan said he would be glad to leave a copy of Senator Kennedy's
press release at the Subcommittee reception desk where we could pick it up.
He also said he would be glad to sit down with us and talk the matter over if
we had any further questions.
Deputy Legislative Counsel
Distribution:
Orig.
- Subj.
1
- ADI'S (Mr.
Wattles)
1
- OGC
1
- O PPB
1
- Mr. Thuermer
1
- FE/TBL
,INTERNAL USE ONLY
Approved For Release 2006/11/08: CIA-RDP74B00415R000200240006-4