NIS COMMITTEE MEETING NO. 58

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP78-05597A000400020044-3
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: C
• Document Page Count: 12
• Document Creation Date: November 9, 2016
• Document Release Date: August 26, 1998
• Sequence Number: 44
• Publication Date: February 21, 1950
• Content Type: MIN

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r~1'b CC?! .. P~,'?'l4; NO. 38
21 Pe . r -nary 3 9;~n!
I. The following
Mr. Lydnaan stateLt . Go r. Nutt
Mr. Fletcher r State . Gil. ;'Nude
"Mr. Clinton State *Cdr. Friedawx
Lt. Cool. Ru et Army *Cdr.
Lt. Col. Kiel Army a j . Lath,
*Lt. Col. Hansen. Arrky
'Jr. Debevo:isea A my
Maj. Cowart toy
*i6a j. Joy Cdr. Howell Navy
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1PC
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CIA
(Acting Chef. .r :".7g
)
'horking
1 Yi4'y sp Sn.4 f3oy..F..:`.3
Observer f an O1:}.,, ti `a e
2. The following rp(: r nts relative to treatment Of -,nte :a_:..gen ^ t or
petroleum pipe lines we-e kec it ed a
a. The subject of "petrolezimt pipe . irn.er~gt iea t,ra; sf"' ,'red z'or
Chapter III ("~~ranspcrtateLora an '-J. Telecommtiaicat;ions) to C.h;apter
(Economic) and aupp._ement No. V' (Petroleum).
b, Respsasa~a b ,~ fogpreparation of -)ortion.s of NJ.:3 dealing
with eotrole pi . li.new is reallocated, e:-Tfeetive at the begin-
ring of F1 1951,, iron the tepar"imient of the Army (Carp ;d ' ; l nee
to the khunition Com?ittee.
C. The draft of the Daub jsn.e and outline guide for "." eti n. 34
(Petroleum Pipe Linos) is paese? to the u~ J.tions Board "etroleuir
Committee. This copmittec~ :Y .1:3_ incornurate the k:equi.re rots
contained therein -.n u;o Sub5ectiovn 62C (etroieum) and Sc. tale
meet No. V (Peerol a.a ). e r_s3 34 is d .3C'Ontinued.
d. The outline=, and cut . i t?~ guider:, for Subsea ui.on A. ;C any
petroleum pipe :fan oo in tF ;f~ ce A a a l be crafted by th o HHun: ;ioes,-s
Board Petroleum CQ ,::L ttee. TNdse drafts will requiz,n by
the X15 Committee 1'ofore becoming eff'ae t. ve.
e. The Corps or ng,ineer?s will co x ca.rraao FAre -Grit,
produce Nab inteilikv;ence eta petroleum =a1 eoe 11no w for the re. a: ncierr
of 1950.
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f. The Inanition Board ? etrolean Ca i.t~ e will rec: -..ve no
additional fn. ds by .:-?eason of e.na a ptioa of ~ spo bili for
Producing, intelligence on pe terra` x eui pipe . ,non.
It',- NIS iratel l.. ;. s.ce concerning other ae s of petrol:*um
trans aoz tat: on., such as tank cars and tank s'Ups, Will remain in
Chapter 111.V to 'hich cross reforerce will be a-Ade in Subsection
620 and Supplement V,
unedited draft of stenographic notes on vna discussion leading to the
foregoing decisions is attached here Ao.
3. The following decisions wero reached relative to c.;s e classification
of suxnius NIS maps distributed to non-1.1W Agencies.
a. The presence of #IS ..reaaa boundary lines on a Map does
not, of itself, require the vap to be classified.
b. The credit line at the bottom of the map (showing the
name of the agency nraparing the yap and the date of preparation,
if indicated) does not, of itself, iecjui.A-e the map to bo classified".
c. The credit line at the top of the map (showing the agency
responsible for the section of which the map is a part) does, Of
'itself, r?e ,uirs the map to be c.: assif fed R STRICTI O. iisncefoxward
this credit line will. be removed from surplus NIS maps.
d. The presence of NIS Area numbers (whether a single nu tuber
or several numbers) on a map ..r u. Tres the rap to be classified
CON F :L TUL when it is used outside the MIS Program. Base maps
with N'TS Areas defined as such will continue to be classified
RJ TRiCTSO used only within the sti1S Program.
4. The Army member submitted e draft of a Proposal secuxity direct:i
to recipients of NIS. D/415 will reproduce this draft, and di;::: ,ribzate It to
the members. The draft will be rece)sidered at the next meeting
..
5. The next meeting was scheduled for 1000 hours, Tuesth r, 28 February
1950, at CIA- 25X1A9a
&tcl: (1)
Distribution:
N16 Committee
Members (4)
Mr. larman (JIG)
AU/ORE LC, 0/N IS
Chief, 0/Ma f0, ?O, U/N.S 3/NIS File
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r ~. so
N,15 CO I TTJ 1 ETlaCT NO. 58
21 February 1950
(Minutes on Ite ; l of of Agenda: Proposal to place
90Petroleurq Pipe dines ?& in Subsection 62C and
Supplement V rather than in Ohapter III )
The question has come up as to whether the treatment of oetroleum pipe
lines should remain in Chapter III or be placed in Chapter VI and Supple-
merit V, or whether parts of it should go in one and parts in the other.
(He then read to the Committee the memorandum from Admiral Biggs re production
of petroleum subsection 620 and Supplement V. He then asked for the views of
the working level in order to get both sides of the question, after which
there would be further discussion.) The issue isa
a. Whether petroleum oioe lines should remain where it now
is in Chapter 111; or
b. I'ahether it should be taken out of Chapter Il1 and out
bodily in Subsection. 62C and Supolement V; or
c. l'Shother some aspects should remain in Chapter 1111 and
others put in Chapter VI and Supplement V.
The basis of our decision should not involve merely consideration of the
paramount interest in the subject. It is quite obvious that both the
ngineers, TC and that type of urger do have a major interest in this subject.
Like vise the users of petroleum intelligence in general have a major interest
in the subject. Le should consider not only the paramount interest but
likewise the comparative ability to produce this type of intelligence because
no matter where it appears in the NIS Program, whether in one or the other or
both, it will be available to all users. 4.e should also consider capability
.to produce. It may develop that, for examplce, the %ng.l.neer: have greater
capability to produce certain parts of this intelligence and that the PC
have greater capability to produce other tyres, or it may develop one or the
other has greater capability all around.
Maj. Latta (PC):
In amplifying Admiral Biggs a remarks, the, Admiral re,posted', in his
letter, discussion generally on all forms of transportation. He ciid not
f 'IN. Ri a T r o x~
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confine it to pipe lines. It is realized that every mode of transportation
is of concern to the agencies dealing vrith transportation as such. In the
petroleum field there exist certain peculiar tynes of transportation which
exist only for petroleum and no other commodity. and some which use the sate
means of transportation that other commodities use. There possible the
Admiral believes that the major work should be done by the PC on those means
of transportation which are exclusively or as a majority used by the petroleum
industry and the remainder of it, statistical, etc., by other agencies, as an
example, pipe lines on the one hand and railways on the other. The set up
within the Department of Defense is such that all intelligence information
collected by CIA and the service agencies that even smells greasy is sent over
to PC. In audition to these sources of information we have direct access t o
industry. As a result of a recent decision, it was decided within the Depart-
ment of Defense that the Engineers would only go to industry through the PC.
As for access to information the PC could go to Amdustry rather than Engineers
going through PC to industry on those matters. As far as pipe lines are
concerned they exist, with the exception of a few water lines amounting to
less than 1 percent of the total in the world, entirely for petroleum or
natural gas and they have no other use. The Admiral thought for that reason
the PC with its direct access to sources of in."ort ation and the paramount
interest it has in that it is used exclusively in the petroleum field,
including natural gas, that that would more naturally aopear in the petroleum
section. This does not deny to any other agency of the National Military
Establishment or of the government the right to come in and ask questions
specifically before or after the information is published for any amount, of
detail they desire.
Lt. Col. tiuwet (r?my)
There are two questions to be solved. The basic one is whether we should
leave petroleum pipe lines where it is or put it in Chapter VI. Another basic
one is -the question of allocation of production responsibility. The directive
under which the PC works does state that petroleum intelligence required by
the Department of Defense will be compiled by the PC and they are to hold
themselves in readiness to meet the needs of the three Secretaries. The main
concern of the Department of the Army Is not necessarily the location of the
material within the NIS but with production responsibility not only in direct
connection with the NIS but in connection with operational responsibilities
exclusive or inclusive of the NTS, that is, operational responsibilities as
distinguished from intelligence responsibilities. le and the other two
services still have responsibility for production of staff intelligence
directed by NSC, each agency being responsible for Its own staff intelligence.
'We wish to be assured that no matter who produces the basic intelligence for
the NIS that A PW will be able to have, when we need it, the intelligence
required to meat our operational commitments. We are concerned with the fact
that Engineers are specifically charged with instructing, repairing, maintain-
ing, and operating portable fixed electric lights, etc., and all other general
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utilities including field water supply and pipe limes, It is axiomatic that
in order properly to fulfill those functions they must have such information
available through such an agency as the nitions Board which entails a
certain amount of duplication. Every time the Engineers need to know a detail,
the PC would not want Army to look at their files, There must be certain
basic files. in Corps of Eaa.gineers. L certain amount; of basic intelligence
which conflicts with NIS will have to be performed by the Department of the
Army.
Maj. Latta (PC).
Inasmuch as the Engineers recognize that the PC is charged with primary
responsibility for intelligence on petroleum matters, including pipe lines,
the fact whether you duplicate such files of the 'C as you need for your own
work in executing your assigned responsibilities is a matter for determination
within your office. It does not mean that having such responsibilities and
desiring to duplicate such information has any significance as far as the
primary responsibility concerned which was placed on the PC by the Secr ct ary
of Defense, who incidentally prohibited the duplication of facilities. The
fact the Engineers acknowledge the primary responsibility as placed by the
Secretary of Defense upon the PC for petroleum intelligence matters should be
sufficient and that if the Engineers desire to duplicate or obtain information
by letter or otherwise they will find that the PC will cooperate. We have
had such requests from the Engineers and they have been acted upon. ':'e should
assume good faith and the fact that a man charged with responsibility wil1
carry out his job.
Lt. Col. ftuwet (Army):
The Secretary of Defense has issued a directive which is quite clear and
which Army is not questioning. The question, of duplication of intelligence
within the Department of Defense is the concern of C3:4 by laws. It does
concern NIS because the question of allocation of responsibility for production.
of the N1 rests with the NIS Committee alone and is executed through the
Director of Central Intelligence.
Col. i4attice4
I don?t want to raise any jurisdictional ,uuastions. When the PC gets into
gear and takes over the responsibility, both of the interested parties in this
question of petroleum pipe lines 'will be in the Department of DDefense. At the
present timepas regards such petroleum intelligence as is being produced one
part is being produced in Department of Defense (Engineers) and the rest is
being produced by the Bureau of Mines. In view of the fact that the forth-
coming producers of all petroleum intelligence will be components of the
Department of Defense, there will be a tendency to keep referring to the
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directive of the Secretary of Defense as final authority in all matters. The
NIS is not subject to the jurisdiction of the Secretary of Defense. The
allocation of responsibility for production and maintenance of HIS and olace-
ment of NIS subjects is within the jurisdiction of the NIS Committee. The
NIS Committee in exercising its jurisdiction or , this must take into account
the reactions and repercussions of any changes that we make have within the
Department of Defense. The two cannot be torn apart. If a change is made it
must be satisfactory to all parties concerned. and certainly components of the
Department of Defense will have to be satisfied. then the petroleum nips lines
and the petroleum supplement are produced, there will. be many users of it
outside of the Department of Defense. NSCID No. 3 directs the HIS Program to
produce all of the basic intelligence needed by the government, not only by
the Department of Defense. If any other government agency shows us that it is
necessary for them to have intelligence, including petroleum intelligence, to
accomplish their mission we are bound to provide them with NIS as well as the
Armed Services. The Department of State, for instance, might very well be
interestea Jr petroleum. to are not attempting at this meeting to decide any
of the interdsi problems of the Department of Defense. tie are trying to
decide this matter from the NIS point of view but in coming to our oositic
from the NIS point of view we must, of course, consider the reactions and
repercussions within the Department of Defense. The jurisdiction over the
NIS and all matters pertaining thereto rests with the NIS Committee but since
both of the oroducing com.oonents now involved are members of the Deoartment
of Defense the special directive should be considered. Final decision must
be made from the broader viewpoint.
Maj. Latta (PC)s
Vie have realized In the PC, Inasmuch as we have worked closely with other
government agencies, the purpose of this NIS and there are no doubts in our
mind about its ultimate use nor about the allocation of responsibility except
such parts of it as in taking cognizance of who 'would produce them who is
doing that sort of wr, rk and has access to information. The PC is placed i.n a
primary position for the information by directive in addition to industry
contact.
Lt. Col. Xuwot (Army)t
HIS meets the basic intelligence requirements of the government. Con-
currently with basic intelligence requirements in terms of HIS, there is a
continuing need to perform intelligence services concurrently with the
production of the HIS. A great deal of that need is being continually satisfied
by the Corps of Engineers. These requests are not only confined to requests
within the Department of the Army but also from without.. The question really
is would the PC be prepared and do they consider it part and parcel of their
charter to accept that responsibility also,
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Maj. Latta (PC):
All sorts of requests come in on petroleum natters, which are continually
being referred to PC by the Secretary of i efenase, ROES, and in addition the
Service Staffs and Secretaries. to have had this responsibility since l9r'2
and to undertake this job is merely ?orwaliz.I_ng one of the things we are
automatically doing anyway.
Col. Nattice
At the present time the Corps of Engineers has the responsibility for
preparing Section 34, Petroleum Pipe Tines. hhere does the Corps of E::gineers
get thu information from rhich it prepares this intelligence F:. through the PC,
through other sources, or whet-e?
Maj. Cowart (.Engineers):
Over a period. of years that has been assembled in the Corps of Engineers
Intelligence Divisic a from all sources - own field collection and utili z a .iQn
of Ill sources which include all available sources on petroleum information.
Engineers has access to CIA, State, Petroleum Board information and own field
collection and assembly of all data collected from year to year.
Assuming that PC should take this over would the Corps of Engineers not
be able to draw on the PC to amplify its own sources for information w:i Uh
which to accomplish its mission?
Maj. Latta (PC):
The Corps of Engineers do call on us.
then the NIS Program has been completed. and placed upon a maintenance
basis, all offices of the government that need basic intelligence, including
.Engineers, PC, and others, will have the NIS available to furnish basic
intelligence upon which to formulate their staff intelligence. At the present
time the NIS Program is by no means that far advanced. There are basic
intelligence questions coming up every day concerning areas which the NlS has
not touched. Therefore, in the interim it is necessary for the various
agencies having to produce estimates to do a certain amount of none basic
intelligence.
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Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army).-
That is correct. Is it correct for us to assume that if the Department
of State comes to ID' through Intelligence cha ; zei with a spocific question
on petroleum, it would be entirely proper to refer it to the PC?
Maj. Latta (PC) s
&actly. That has been the practice of Air Force and Navy for last two
years. On pipe lines specifically, the Quartermaster Corps asked the opinion
of industry and petroleum people generally as to whether big and littlo inch
will go back in gas service. There have been questions from outside; the
Department of Defense and inside the Department of Defense.
Lt. Col. Ftuwet (Army):
I would like to point out that, a great many questions of that nature are
presently being shortatopned by Engineers and handled by them before reaching
the PC.
Ike do carry on at the nredsent time a collection program in connection
with pipe lines which is designed specifically to fulfill NIS requirements.
Assuming that the allocation of responsibility is changed from the Department
of the Arty to the Munitions Board, do. we automatically go out of that
collection businesu and let PC take over or do we continue to budget and
carry that burden.?
Maj. Latta (PC):
Vthat money it takes and what the system is, I am not familiar with field
collection service at the present time. Cannot answer the question.
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army);
Will you continue as you do nor to depend to a certain extent upon the
existing field collection agencies operated by the Department of the Army?
Ma j . Latta (PC):
If that is part of ID, Iii goes right on. .''ere field collectors in the
field before NId or have they been put there specifically for the NIS?
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Lt. Coll. Ruwet (AMY).
Co]lection teams were sent dut specifically to fill specific gaps in
basic intelligence. .
Ma j . Latta (PC) $
The teams do not confine themselves to petroleum pipe lines.
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Gray):
In some cases it would be confined to petroleum.
Maj. Latta (PC):
If the intelligence ageneiee presently existing cannot get the information
or obtain it from any industry source, we would have to obtain that through
some govex imental sources. &ssu a it would re~u ire no greater budgetary
amount to pick up information on petroleum if (teams) go out for something
also. .1-twill be necessary to examine all sources to determine any gaps.
Cdr. Howell (Navy);
All these matters were stated vh the PC got the responsibility for
production. That they would be required to produce, and also take over
responsibility for maintenance was 'specifically covered in agreements between
CIA and PC.
Lt. Col:. Ruwet ( qy):
Ve have supported and been able to budget for certain collection necessary
for NI but we will not be able stay longer to support a budget to collect
specifically this sort of technical information.
My understanding of the matter of responsibility for production and
maintenance of the petroleum supolemaat and Subsection 620 is the same as
Cdr. Rowell?s view. then the PC made its estimate of the budget, all those
matters were taken. into consideration. At that time-petroleum pipe lines was
in Chapter 111. Whether or not the PC envisions taking over petroleum pipe
lines, I donut know. The budget for 1951 for this matter is already in.
Benue, any demands or requests by the PC for additional slices of CIA budget
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V loaf
by reason of the fact that PC now takes over petroleum *)ipe lines would not
be met.
Cdr. Friedman (PC):
In order to satisfactorily present the complete petroleum picture, we
must tie in certain phases of petroleum transportation. To eliminate the
transportation picture completely would not permit us to present a good
petroleum chapter. It must be covered in a satisfactory measure so we can
perform our function.
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army):
Vie agree that the question of the placement of petroleum pipe line:., in
either Chapter III. or Chapter VI is immaterial. It should be cross-referenced
between VI and II1:. In light of the discussion here today, we have no
objection to transfer of allocation.
Mr. Lydman (State):
V,e would prefer to have it in Chapter VI -- both in the section and in
the supplement. For our oarticulaar use petroleum pine lines is an economic
problem and we want it in Chapter VI.
Lt. Col. lade (Air Force): Agreed.
Lt. Cdr. Nutt (Navy): Agreed.
Col. Ddattice a
Is it agreed that petroleum Wipe lines will be transferred in toto from
Chapter ill, Section 34 to Subsection 62C and Supplement V?
Cdr. Howell (Navy):
Will same treatment be accorded in both places?
Section 34 should be withdrawn from Chapter III and turned over to the PC.
It would have to be worked into Subsection 62C and Supolement V by the PC.
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Cdr, Howell (Navy):
As to Chanter VI - State as user: wants a discussion of that material
from a sociological and economical point of view. The services want pirle
lines from a facility point of view. Two different end results for two
different ourposes. It will have to meet both r-jyuiremants.
Col. Mattice:
It will have to meet all tiequirements of all users. It is true that the
Department of State acts as the section coordinator for Section 62 which
includes 62C. Likewise, since Supplement V is hooked on to 62C, the .Depart-
ment of State will cool inate Sunplement V. In other words, the Department
of State will retain its status as section and sup-lement coordinator.
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army)t
The final approval of the outline is up to the NIS Committee.
Col. Mattjce:
It will be approved or revised if it does not meet the approval of
the Committee.
Lt. Cdr. Nutt (Navy):
If pipe lines as a facility of transportation are out in the Economic
chapter, how are we going to cover that facility in transportation? The
services are concerned with pipe lines as such and as to how much oil can
be transported,
This will be taken care of by cross reference, Section 34 will be
withdrawn from Chapter III and passed to the PC to be integrated into Sub-
section 62C and Supplement V. The final draft of both will be submitted to
the NIS Committee, 'arid in the meantime ID will continue to work on the
subject of petroleum pipe lines for Chapter III until the end of the fiscal year.
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army):
It is suggested that notation be made that the final outline will be
subject to the approval of the NIS Committee at which time each agency can
examine it to see whether in fact it meets the requirements of that agency.
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Will production start at beginning of next fiscal year?
Col. Uattice: Yes.
Lt. Col. kuwet (Army)
The Engineers will continue until the end of this fiscal. year,
Mr. Ortiz (PC):
T have a list of countries fork 1950. l+lhere will the PC take up the
responsibility - at the end of the fiscal year or those countries which have
not been finished?
Lt. Col. Ruwet (Army):
You will have to take up whare physically left oft and I do not think
Army will finish schedule.
The JS new requirements and priorities might be out this week. We will
then, as a matter of urgent priority, revise the schedule for 1950 and
formulate the scheth 1e for 1951 based on the new requirements and the ria
priorities. I do not believe anyone should worry about schedules at this time.
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