CONGRESSIONAL RECORD--HOUSE

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP83B00823R000700040031-3
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 12
• Document Creation Date: December 9, 2016
• Document Release Date: April 14, 2000
• Sequence Number: 31
• Publication Date: February 10, 1975
• Content Type: OPEN

FebntarygicppPved For R QQ Q,3g&l6~ 823R000700040031-3H 871
(1) by striking out "$85,000,000" and in- SEC. 8. Section 303(c) (1)' of the Reional The SPEAKER. The gentleman from
serting in lieu thereof "$282,000,000"; and Rail Reorganization Act of 1973 (45/ms.C._, Illinois (Mr. MURPHY) is recognized for
(2) by adding at the end thereof the fol- 745(c) (1).) is amended by striking out the,a
1 hour.
lowing new sentence: "Of amounts au- last word of paragraph. (A); by striking out
thorized to be appropriated under this sub- the period at the end of paragraph (B) and Mr. 1VIURPHY of he gentleman Speaker,
section, $50,000,000 shall be available solely inserting "; and" In lieu thereof; and by-in- - I yield 30 minutes to the gentleman from
to pay to the trustees of railroads in reor- serting after paragraph (B) the following Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON) pending which I
ganization such sums as may be necessary new paragraph: yield myself such time as I may consume.
to provide such railroads with amounts equal "(C) what portion of the proceeds received-, (Mr. MURPHY of Illinois asked and
to revenues attributable to aria increases by a railroad in reorganization from an en- was given permission- to revise and
proposed by such railroads a suspended by lily other than the Corporation for the sale,, extend his remarks.)
the Interstate Commerce Commission during lease,-or transfer of property subject to an -
the calendar year 1975, if the Secretary deter- agreement under section: 213 or section 215' Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. dMr. e Speaker,
mines that such paymenti. are necessary to (a) (I)- or (2) of this Act reflects value House Resolution 174 provides for an
carry out this section.". attributable to the maintenance of improve- open rule with 1 hour of-62neral debate
SEC. 7. Section 215 o1T the Regional Rail meat provided pursuant to the agreement.". on House Resolution. 138, a resolution
Reorganization Act of 1973 (45 U.S.C. 725) SEC*. 9. Title VI of.-.the Regional Rail Re- - establishing -a Select Committee on In-
is amended to read as follows: organzation Act of 1973, is amended by add - teliigence.
in g at the end thereof the following new
"IN=IM AGREEMENTS section:. House Resolution 138 authorizes the
-
"SEC. 215. (a) PvRposES -Prior to the date "TAX PAYMENTS TO STATES - Select Commitee on Intelligence-to-con-
'upon which rail properties are conveyed to "SEC - 605. (a) Notwithstanding any other duct an inouiry" into the collection and
the Corporation under this Act, the Seere- provision of law; no railroad in reorganiza- use of intelligence information and alle-
tary, with the approval of the- Association, tion shall withhold from any State, or any gations of improper and illegal activities
is authorized to enter into agreements with political, subdivision thereof, the payment of intelligence agencies in the United
the trustees of the1 railroads in reorganiza- of the portion of any ,tax owed by such rail- States and abroad.
tion in the regiony (or railroads- leased, on- road to such State or subdivision, which por- House Resoluton 138 also
authorizes
erated, or controlled by railroads in- tion has been.- collected by such railroad the Select Committee to inquire in the
reorganization)- ; - from any tenant thereof.
to
"(1) performmthe program of ai "(b) An
on designated rail properties ( )
y rail road w aic ofhis secton b _ Gies in furtherance fgthe study.agen-
roads until the date rail properties are con- withholding; any portion of a tax referred to Mr, Speaker, I urge the adoption of
veyed under this Act; in such sub ection shall be fined not more House Resolution 174 in order that we
"(2) to improve rail properties of such than $10,000 for each such violation.", may discuss; debate, and pass House Res-
-railroads. and u _r s olution 138. -
to acquire rail properties. for lease The motion was agreed to.
(Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr.
or loan to acqu ireh railroads until the date The Senate bill was ordered to. be
Speaker, I yield myself such time as I
such rail properties are conveyed under this read a third time, was read the third " may require.
Act, and subsequently for conveyance pur- time and passed-, and a motion to- re- (Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois asked and
suant to the final system plan, or to acquire considelwas laid on the table.
interests in such rail properties owned by - was given permission to revise and ex
or leased to ;any such railroads or in A similar House bill (H.R. 2051) was tend his remarks.)
pur- laid on the table.
chase money obligations therefor. . . is ANDERSON of Illinois: Mr.
"(b) CoNprrroxs.-Agreements pursuant Speaker, I think the distinguished gen
to subsection (a) of this section shall con- tleman from Illinois (Mr. MURPHY)
Lain such reasonable terms and conditions GENERAL LEAVE
my
,
as the Secretary may prescribe. In addition, lLlr..TAGGERS. Mi. Speaker, I ask colleague on the Committee on Rules,
has
agreements;. under paragraphs (1) and, (2) unan' sous consent that all Members explained the purpose of this ekes i -
of subsection (a) of this section shall pro- trde I would merely add that it makes in
vide -thatmay have .5 legislative days in which to. order House Resolution 138, which in-
"(1) to ,the extent that physical condi- eaten their remarks on the bill just volves the original jurisdiction of the
tton is used as a basis for determining, passe House Committee on Rules because it
under section 206(f) or 303(c) of this Act, The SPEAKER, Is there objection to would establish- a Select Committee on
the value bf properties subject to such an the retest of the gentleman from West - Intelligence.
agreement 'and designated for transfer to the Virgin ?
Corporation under the final system plan
It would have
of course
. There
b
,
,
,
was no objection.
een possible
the physical condition of the properties on under the rules of the House to bring
the e secti le date of the agreement shall be that matter before this body as a priVi-
used; and ESTABLISHING A SELECT COMMIT- Ieged matter, not subject to amendment,
"(2) in the event that property subject to TEE ON INTELLIGENCE in which case it would have been neces-
t
to an he agreement is sold, leased, or transferred salt' for me, or someone on this side of
trustees entity other than the Corporation, the Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Speaker, the aisle, when the previous question was
or railroad shall pay or assign to the by direction of the Committee on Rules, moved, to urge the defeat of the previous
Secretary that portion of the proceeds of I call up House Re olution 174 and ask question in order to submit a resolution
such sale,,. lease, or transfer which reflects for its immediate consideration.
value attributable to the maintenance and which would be open to amendment. -
improv
value ement provided pursuant to the agree- The Clerk read the resolution, as fol- Mr. Speakel, I am grateful to my col-
meet. lows: RES. 174 league on the committee, the gentleman
"(c) OIiLICATIONS -Notwithstanding sec- from Missouri (Mr. BOLLING), who of-
lion 210(b) of ttitle, the Association shat- Resolved, That upon the adoption of this
Issue obligations
0(b) of this h under section 210(a) shall resolution it shall be in order to move that tion for the open rule, a e Rules solution a mak-
e in a() f the House resolve itself into the Committee lion for an open rule, a re-
issue ts age Inr nd s sets and t sufficient 21 re the a Core of the Whole House an the State of the ing this matter subject to debate under
such uc ag to- assume any such obligations. the The Union for the consideration of the resolution Z completely open rule, which I think is
poation amount of obligations obli ationd The (H. Res. 138) establishing a Select Committee proper procedure in view of the very im-tin aggrega sea u and outstanding iss
ts at
any one on Intelligence. After general debate, which portant issues involved and the fact that
time shall not exceed $300,000.000. The one `,shall be confined to the resolution and shad I have four amendments that I wish to As- t time Steal with the approval 0 the Secretary, 'continue not to exceed one hour, to be equal- - offer to the resolution. There may Shall designate in the final s ft the Secr ty divided and controlled by the chairman be,
shall d ig Bitch obligations che final issued and ranking minority member of the Com-
poon of of course, others who have other amend-
be
issued which s. obe, issu or that
refinanced or the mittee on Rules, the resolution shall be read meats in addition to the four that I
terms thereof, and that portion d and the for amendment under the five-minute rule. have to offer, but I will not take the time
the Corporation shall that
roltio from its o which At the conclusion of the consideration of now under the rule to discuss those
gallons. the resolution for amendment, the Commit- ametldmerits We will have an hour to
tea shall rise and report the resolution to the do so under. general debate, and at that
"(d) CONVEYANCE.-The Secretary may House with such amendments as may have
convey to the; Corporation, with or without been adopted, and the previous question time I will" undertake to 'differ explain with the
those
receipt of conideration, any property or in- shall be considered as ordered on the reolu- partlC lets in which I differ
terests acquirec%by, transferred to, or other- tion and amendments thereto to final passage drafters of House Resolution 138 and
wise held by the Secretary pursuant to this without intervening motion except one mo- think that their. product could be im-
section or section 213 of this Act.". tion to recommit.
d
prove
nigh.
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 H 872 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD - HOUSE - February Y 9 1975
Mr. Speaker,,4pA[9jMl`cl1reonertiJea? yQWeu VI ver~'S6md ` i'rferT 'BV~ a4SKUUU (g Y5 MLU oi~3 ss of
from Illinois in urging the adoption of ments, I point out to the gentlemen, to U.S. intelligence activities.
the rule so that we can proceed with eliminate the expense, to take out of the . House Resolution 138 also authorizes
the debate on this resolution. resolution we have the open-ended au- the select committee to inquire into the
Mr. BADMAN. Mr. Speaker, will the thorization and replace it with the cell- activities of certain governmental agen-
gentlemanyield? ing, and a subceiling, as well, on outside cies in furtherance of their study.
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to consultants, and I think, also, change the These agencies include, among others,
the gentleman from Maryland. reporting date, to try to compress into a the National Security Council; the Cen-
Mr. BAUMAN. Mr. Speaker, I would shorter time scale the work of the com- tral Intelligence Agency; the intelligence
like to ask the gentleman from Illinois mittee, so that they would not be en- components of the Departments of the
to give me his opinion on this set of cir- couraged to endlessly go on delving into Army, Navy, and Air Force; the Intelli-
cumstances: We have a presidential these matters and they would finish their gene and Research Bureau of the De-
commission headed by the vice president work quickly and expeditiously. partment of State; the Federal Bureau
devoting itself to a complete investiga- u So I am going to try in these amend- of Investigation; the Department of the
would consider. - questions the gentleman has expressed. Mr. Chairman, I think this resoiu-
We have a committee- of the other Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Speaker, tion is long overdue. Earlier one of the
body, which will do the same thing. Now : I move the previous question on the res- Members questioned the idea of why
we are creating a third independent body olution. the House is engaging in the tame ac-
these other groups which will go over The resolution was ageed to. sion~and the Senate is already- engaged
the same ground. We have just abolished A motion to reconsider was. laid on the in. I would like to answer that question
the House Internal Security Committee, -- table. in this way:
and one of the arguments was that it was Mr. MURPHY-of Illinois. Mr.. Speaker, As far as the Presidential Commis-
the duty of other agencies to investigate I- move that the House resolve itself into sion is concerned; we have the execu-.
needed. How, in times when we are faced State of the Union for the consideration vestigating an executive agency. As far
with economic problems and the need to of the resolution (H. Res. 138) estab- as the. Senate is concerned, I agree with
cut back on the budget, can we justify lishing a Select Committee on Intelli- my colleague, the gentleman.from 1111- .
creating still another committee to go Bence. nois (Mr: ANDERSON), that possibly this
over this same ground? Will the gentle- The SPEAKER. The question is on the should have been a joint committee.
man address himself to that? motion offered by the gentleman from However, the Senate committee is al- -
flable concerns about the possibility of IN THE COWTArrTEE OF THE WHOLE ' in pursuing its own investigation.
duplication,' and those have been ex- : Accordingly the House resolved itself Mr. Chairman, yesterday the Commit-
pressed by many Members of.this body.- into the Committee of the Whole House tee on Rules adopted four amendments
the gentleman refers, I believe is sched- - eration of House Resolution 138, with and I understand the gentleman from
uled to report on or about the 4th of - Mr. FLYNT in the chair. - Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON) has some fur-
April 1975, and I think there are seven The Clerk read the title of the resolu- ther amendments. he intends to offer .
other members on that Commission. It tion. today
was felt, and I think with some justinca- By unanimous consent, the first read- Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr.'
tion that in addition to having the 'ing of the resolution was dispensed. with. Chairman, I yield myself 10 minutes.
executive branch review this matter, that 'The CHAIRMAN. Under the rule, the (Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois asked and
i
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.
ith it
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i
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)
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URPHY
was given permission to revise and ex-
and with its independent. responsibility will be recognized for 30 minutes, and the tend his remarks.)
"
for oversight, should undertake a similar' gentleman from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON) Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chafr-
investigation. My preference. frankly. will be recognized for 30 minutes.
from Pennsylvania (Mr. BIESTER), earlier . Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair- uvL . nAUMAN) moments ago, certa:niy
this year a resolution-we had some co- - man, I yield myself such time as I may my preference would have been for the
sponsors, as I recall it-with the idea of a consume. creation of a joint committee in order to
joint Senate-House committee to conduct -(M-r. MURPHY of Illinois asked and eliminate the possibilities of duplication ?
oversight on this whole question. Unfor- was given permission to revise and ex- and waste- that are inherent, -I think,
tunately, the Senate chose to go ahead tend his remarks.) when we have two committees function
rather quickly and establish their own Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair- ing in the same area.
Senate select committee. I think that, man, House Resolution 138 establishes a However, I think we have passed that.
part of the House to set up a joint com- to be composed of 10 members; to be out.
mittee. It would be rather futile for us to appointed by the Speaker, who shall des- I want to start by saying that I cei?-
p:oceed with that idea because there is ignate one of the members as chairman. tainly begin with the conviction that in
little likelihood the Senate will rescind its ? House Resolution 138, as reported by view of the controversy that has arisen
that the Senate has gone ahead. I heard House Resolution 138 authorizes the and illegal operation in the late 1960's
this morning that on yesterday the senior Select Committee on Intelligence to con- and in the early 1970's and that it had
Senator from Idaho, the chairman of duct an inquiry into the collection and - been keeping files on 10,000 Americans
that committee, has announced he will use of intelligence information and al- by each unit reporting to the Director,
undertake to coordinate the work of his legations of improper and illegal activi- we should exercise our oversight author-
committee with the work of any commit- ties of intelligence agencies in the United ity in this matter. -
tee suggested by this House to avoid the States and abroad. The resolution au- And there were the other reports that
duplication which the gentleman fears. torizes the select committee to review were given great currency and circula-
If he carries out that pledge-and I have the procedures and effectiveness of coor- tion about domestic break-ins and wire
no reason to doubt that he will-perhaps dination between the various intelligence' tappings and covert mail inspections.
some of the duplications and the needless components of the U.S. Government. The Certainly I think that this entitles us-
expense that might be Incurred can be committee shall also determine whether more than entitles us; I think it man-
avoided. ' or not there is a need for, improved or -dates our concern-to exercise our super-
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 February -A' pfb ed For RL4@ 2*W61 O3R WROMM60823R00070004003.1-1873
visory role, our oversight authority in charges that anyone is out on a fishing dealing with the very important matter
this area. expedition designed to embarrass the of specific safeguards for protecting clas-
I cannot help but recall for the Mem- past administration or the present ad- sifted materials.
bers of this body, as I did for the mem- ministration, because this problem ex- There is some very general language
hers of my committee, that it was 12 tends back for many years into adminis in the resolution dealing with this sub-
years ago, in the 88th Congress, that I trations both Democrat and Republican. ject, and it merely says that the ,com-
sponsored a resolution for a joint com- At least since the time, I believe, of mittee shall establish rules as they deem
mittee. Our now absent colleague, at that John F. Kennedy there has been increas- necessary to prevent unauthorized dis-
time the gentleman from New York, Mr. ing involvement, apparently, on the part 'closures of information and testimony.
Lindsay being the principal sponsor, I of the CIA particularly and perhaps I would suggest that better language
felt then and I feel now that a committee other intelligence agencies of the Federal would be language identical to that in
specifically devoted and charged with the Government as well, in some of these the Senate resolution. I have taken that
responsibility of oversight in this area is activities, both covert and overt, that language exactly as it was passed in the
necessary and is important. _ have stirred recent. alarms. Therefore, other body, providing that'the committee
But having said,all of that, it seems to I think that it is a bipartisan problem. shall set up specific procedures to clear
me, as I read this particular resolution, It ought to be approached in a biparti- individuals, to provide them with the
that it grants the most sweeping au- san fashion, and I would hope, therefore, ' necessary security clearances before they
thority imaginable. There is literally no that in establishing ratios on this com- deal with these very sensitive and, I am
Federal agency, as I read this legisla- mittee, we would not be bound by some sure, highly classified materials.
tion, that would be entirely immune standard rule as it deals with the ordi- There is nothing very radical about the
from a probe because it gives no deft- nary legislative committee. proposals I have made. I think they will
nition `of "intelligence." Let me point out one specific example. give us the sense in. this House that we
In section 3 it lists all of the agencies In the last Congress, when we set out to are moving in a bipartisan and very or-
that were mentioned a moment ago by investigate the operations of this Con- derly fashion.in coordination- with the
the gentleman from Illinois (Mr. MUR- gress=and what could be nearer and . activities of the other body so. as to get
PHY). These include all great depart- dearer to our hearts than that? And more on with the needed business of deciding
ments of the Government like the De- sensitive, really, to our individual role what went wrong, if it did go wrong and,
partment of Justice and the Department as legislators, than the operations of this more importantly, what we can now do
of the Treasury, even the Energy, Re- body? We did not establish that com- to recommend a better and more con-
search and Development Administration, mittee with. a partisan ratio. We estab- tinuing type of oversight of the Intel-
as well as those. intelligence agencies lished it under the chairmanship-and ' ligence community in the future.
with which we are more familiar, the the very able chairmanship-of the gen- So I hope the Members will support
CIA, the FBI, the Defense Intelligence tleman from Missouri (Mr.- BOLLING) on the amendments that I have described
Agency, and 'all of the defense intelli- a 5-to-5 ratio, 5 Democrats and 5 Re- Then they are offered, when we debate
gene components of the Departments publicans. They: went very thoroughly, this under the 5-minute rule, and with
of the Army, the Navy, and the Air Force. for almost 18 months, into all of the. those amendments I think we will be able
This is sweeping authority indeed, and ramifications and operations of this to get on with the very important task
it seems to me that we have to be very ' House and its committees, and came up that has to be dealt with.
careful that we do, therefore, make the with a very excellent report. Mr. MYERS of Indiana. Mr. Chairman,
terms of the investigative effort so broad I think a bipartisan committee can do will the gentleman yield?
and so all-encompassing, without any the same, kind of job if they are allowed Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to
boundaries whatsoever, that we get into to function in a truly bipartisan manner, the gentleman from Indiana.
this mire and this morass of investiga- as I have suggested. Mr. MYERS of Indiana. Mr. Chairman
tive activity that would cost untold hun- Second, I think that the fact that I think no one would disagree about the
dreds of thousands, even millions, of dol- there is no price tag on this resolution oversight authority and responsibility
tars and yet not be productive of the kind makes it defective; that, just as the Sen- this House has, so far as that oversight
of recommendations that we hope will ate did in its resolution, it provided $750,- pertains to amendments and changes in
come out of this committee if it is created 000 as an expense budget, and a $100,- the law and in the statutes, and also so
and
and out of the committee in the Senate 000 subceiling budget for outside con- far as responsibility as to how funds ap-
well. sultants. It makes good sense to do that propriated by this Congress are spent as
It is for that reason, 'not because I in this resolution. If the committee finds respects various activities, but I am not
at all
oppose the idea that we have a legitimate that it is- going to' have to expend more sure that it is intended by the over-
oversight function with which we ought funds than it can come back and get an sight responsibility to limit them to that.
to be concerned, that I have circulated additional authorization, I am sure, for Does the gentleman foresee the pos-
these four amendments and commended additional expenditures. But let us not mittee sibility that this oversight select com-
them to the membership of this body, start out with what the. gentleman from might get into the policymaking
.with the hope that they would adopt Maryland was worried about a few min- duties of the various agencies?
them today as amendments to House utes ago so that We get into the kind of Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. No, I do
Resolution 138. boundless investigation that just prolif- not think it would attempt to do that.
First of all, I want to refer to the one erates in all directions at once, because We would have to physically decry any
that would provide for a five and five there is absolutely no ceiling at all on effort to interfere with the legitimate
membership on the committee. This res- the expenditure of funds. I hope that intelligence-gathering functions.
- olution will follow otherwise the rule of amendment'when it is offered will have The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gen-
the Democratic caucus, which provides your support. tleman has expired.
for two-thirds plus one as the ratio of Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr: Chair-
for instead of waiting until next man, I yield myself 3 additional minutes.
Democrats to Republicans on this year, until the end of January, let us I do not think there is any disagree-
committee. give it a September 1 reporting date. Let ment--or I hope there is not any wide-
This is not a legislative committee. us coordinate our activities with the spread disagreement-with the proposi-
Whatever justification the Members on activities of the other body. The senior tion that we need an intelligence service
this side of the aisle may have for such Senator from Idaho, as I said a few in this country to properly guarantee our
a rule in the House caucus as it applies minutes ago, said that he is willing to national security. Agencies of the kind
to legislative committees, it should not coordinate his efforts and give their re- _ that are listed in this resolution-the
apply to a select committee investigating port by September 1. So it makes sense Defense Intelligence Agency, the FBI, the
one of the most delicate, sensitive areas to me that we have a similar reporting - CIA-all are needed. It is a question,
that could possibly be encompassed date so that we can work in tandem with however, of making sure that they carry
within the scope of any, congressional that comittee, then, and better coordi- out that intelligence function in a way
investigation. nate the activities of the two Houses in that does not unconstitutionally violate
I make no blind, blatant charges of this area. individual rights of Americans here at
partisanship over here. I' make no Finally, I will offer an amendment home, and also, I think, does not involve
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 II 874- Approved For R ~~ b* E DP 50823RO l (~110y?-J975 thetas in activities that are really nonger- committees that do have an Involvement deny to the E7 ecutive the right to set up-
mane and alien to the true intelligence or a partial involvement. Possibly only the Commission which they have to look
function. one could have the overall jurisdiction to into the allegations of impropriety, nor
Mr, MYERS of Indiana. Will the gen- cover all aspects. do we intend. to prejudge the work and
tleman yield further? For example, some have jurisdiction the recommendations of that Commis-
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to over the FBI, others have jurisdiction sion. But_ certainly as the executive
the gentleman from Indiana. over the CIA, et cetera. It is designed branch has the right to oversee those ac-
Mr. MYERS of Indiana. I thank the that these committees will continue to do tions, very clearly the Congress also does,
gentleman for yielding. what they are empowered to do under and this is what we intend to do today.
If I understand his response, there-is the existing rules of the House. We have many committees which have
absolutely .no intent to give this select** This committee is designed to look at jurisdiction. Igor- instance, the Commit-
committee the authority to influence several factors primarily: Is there sub- . tee on the Judiciary has jurisdiction over
policymaking by any of the agencies, stance to the allegations. of wrong- the FBI, and the Committeg on Armed
that they will have the responsibility doing? Services has jurisdiction over the CIA,
overall, but it is simply to limit the au- Should there be recommendations for and the Committee on Banking and Cur-
thority to oversight as to Americans and ? changes in the methods in which the rency has jurisdiction over the Treasury
funds used; is that correct? various intelligence services are conduct- and_ Internal Revenue. There are many-
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I want to ing their activities-things of that type? committees. The Appropriations Commit-
be very _candid with the gentleman.. I It would not be to usurp the powers of - tee also has a function here. But I doubt
cannot assure him that they will not the existing committees or subcommit- whether there is- any one committee that
make recommendations that in effect tees. has overall jurisdiction and can look at.
would deal in the policy area or with The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gen- all the intelligence branches of the U.S
the policymaking function of these agen- tieman has expired. Government,. with the possible exception.
ties, but let me remind him that this Mr. MURPHY of Illinois.. Mr. Chair- and I say with the possible exception, of
committee has no legislative authority'.. man, I yield 7 minutes to the gentleman the Government Operations Committee.
They cannot pass on anything. All they from Connecticut (Mr. GrsIMO). It may have:
can do is report to us, I hope, by Septem- (Mr. GIAIMO. asked and was given Be that as It may, there has been- a
her 1, 1975, and make recommendations permission to revise and. extend his re- growing- feelg- among the overwhelm-- -
which we as a full House would then act- marks.). ing majority of Members that there-
upon. Mr. GIAIMO. Mr. Chairman, let me should be a per se Intelligence Commit-=
Mr. BAUMAN.. Mr. -Chairman, will the explain to the Members why we are ap- tee to look into, these allegations , of
gentleman yield? - pearing here today on this resolution to. wrongdoing.
Mr. ANDERSON of. Illinois. I yield to establish a Select Committee on Intelli- . I. myself would have preferred a joint
the gentleman from Maryland. gence. There has been a-growing belie; co1.mitteetee..I am sure that many.of us
sure the gentles
Mr. BADMAN. I thank the gentleman among the Members of Congress and couehave.. a am I sure
for yielding. among the Public at large that all is not man from Illinois (Mr. rrnEttsorr) rec-
There are at least seven different well with the intelligence agencies of the ogmzes that as a practical matter the-
standing committees that have some sort- United States or that all may not be other body has already begun with its
of jurisdiction over intelligence activi- well and a growing concern that Con- select committee and there is very little
ties in the House. I have heard rumors gress should exercise to a greater degree hope of having a joint committee. Inci-
that, regardless of what the House may than- it has its oversight function. dentally, it may well be that one of. the
do in creating a select committee, some We are intending to maintain a good recommendations of this committee
of these committees or the subcommittee and adequate intelligence service for. might be to recommend a permanent.
chairmen will proceed with collateral in-:- the United States. We are equally de- joint committee with the other body. t
vestigations of the same issue. termined to assure the rights of the citi- We deliberately set a termination date
Does the gentleman have any informa- zens of the- United States so that these
tion about ,any plans to at least- try to. rights will not be infringed in any way of January 31, 1976, because we did not
consolidate all of these investigations,. by anyone, and particularly. by Federal want to make this select committee a _
or are-we going to go off in all different intelligence agencies. permanent committee or to carry, on its
directions at once for whatever purposes. There have been very serious allega- activities year after year.,
the individual committees involved may tions of possible wrongdoing on the part Because of the overwhelming feeling
have? of some intelligence agencies. We do not of so many Members of the majority of
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. My per- know whether these allegations- are true this House that there was need for a
sonal hope would certainly be that dur- in fact or not, but we certainly feel that select committee,, this matter was re-
ing the period that this select committee Congress has the absolute obligation and ferred by the caucus of the Democratic
is functioning, if it is. established, there duty. to the American people to look into Party in the- House to .the Steering and
would be a moratorium on a lot of in- it and to exercise its oversight function Policy. Committee, so that we could
vestigative activity by-these other sub tQ determine whether there is any merit properly-study this matter and come up
committees. Obviously. I am not in a po to these allegations of wrongdoing. with- recommendations.
sition to speak; however, for the gentle- Beyond that, many of these intelli- We met in the Steering -and Policy.
men who might be in a position to con- gence agencies have been in existence for Committee' with all the interested com-
tinue to assert that jurisdiction. many, many years, some from before mittee chairmen and discussed the mat-
Mr. BAUMAN. If the gentleman will. World - War If, and some of our major ter with them and then, because of the
yield further, there is, however, nothing ones certainly came into prominence complexity of the matter, it was referred
in this resolution that says so? . right after World War II. Their means of to a task force of the Steering and Pol-
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. No. There conducting their activities developed in - icy Committee and other Members to
is nothing in here that specifically says those years, particularly in the late 1940's make further recommendations. The
there is a moratorium. - . and early 1950's. Are these activities still task force consisted of myself, the: gen-
Mr. GIAIMO. Mr. Chairman, will the proper ones? Are they still wise ones in tieman from Michigan (Mr. NEDzi), the
gentleman yield? which those agencies should be involved? gentleman from California (Mr. Moss) ,
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to Should we, for example, conduct covert the gentleman from New York (Mr.
the gentleman from Connecticut. operations in the same way in which we BnvGrkM), the gentleman from Massa
Mr. GIAIMO. I thank the gentleman have been doing? This is another area of chusetts. (Mr. HARRINGTO?r), and the gen-
for yielding. investigation by this select committee. tieman from South Carolina (Mr. DAVIS). -
This legislation is not designed to pro Therefore, it was t1be feeling of the After additional meetings and considera-
hibit in any way any existing legislative overwhelming majority of those Mem- tions we proposed the resolution which
committee or any other committee which bers of the majority party in their caucus is before us today, urging that it be
has jurisdiction in this area from con- that a committee of the Congress should adopted and that we get on with this
ducting its work. The gentleman is right. look into this entire matter of activities -work. This committee then would have -
There are about seven committees or sub- of the intelligence agencies. We do not the function to look into the allegations
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 February 19,-'1975 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE
of improprieu~ppr i i~sO pas ,e PtQ1Q91!9 C6IA f P83B00823R000700040031.-3 875
nk at s o Para- permission to revise and extend his re-
goals. mount concern and if we can look into marks,)
Second, it -was to look into whether or that and address ourselves to that.prob- Mr. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, I want
not there is adequate oversight, both by lem, the other problems can then be re- to express myself in general support of
the executive branch and by the Con-
ol
s
ved also. this legislation. It seems to me, how-
gress, of the intelligence activities. The CHAIRMAN. The time'of the gen- ever, that the focus of our attention
Third, it would study the necessity, tleman has again expired.
the nature, and the extent of overt and Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. I yield 1 ad- ashould b on the illegal, the aj,
nd the immoral acts, or alleged acts,
covert intelligence activities by United ditional minute to the gentleman from conducted by the CIA, FBI and other in-
States intelligence instrumentalities here - Connecticut
.
and abroad, and whether ,or not ther.?e Mr. GIAIMO. I yield to the gentle-
should be some changes, for example, in man from California (Mr.- JOHN L.
the basic laws which apply to them. BURTON).
This would be the function of this Mr. JOHN L. BURTON. Mr. Chair-
committee. It would be limited in dura- man, I thank the gentleman for. yield-
tion. It would report back to the House ing.
by the end. of this year. I doubt that the I ' was wondering if the gentleman
date that the other body has is a real- would answer two questions. The resolu-
istic one. I suspect that that, September tion, although it does not state it as
date will be extended to the end of the such, is broad enough that there would
year. be an inquiry_ into the type of activities
I urge adoption bf the resolution. . such as the destabilization of Chile or
The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gen- interfering with the internal affairs of.
tleman has expired. other nations.
Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. I yield 2 ad
- M
GIAI
,
r.
MO. The question of desta-
ditional minutes to the gentleman from bilization of the -Chilean Government
Connecticut. would come under any study Mr. GIAIMO. Mr. Chairman, I yield the covert the intelligence activities by the U.S.S. interntel
gentleman from Maryland. (Mr. ligence services abroad. That Is within
MITCHELL). the committee's jurisdiction.
Mr. MITCHELL of Maryland. Mr. Mr. JOHN L. BURTON. Last, the pas-
Chairman, I want to propound a ques- sage of this legislation and the creation
tion to the gentleman from Connecticut. Of this committee in no way would put a
First of all, let me say, that I think moratorium on any legislative committee
this resolution and the creation of this of this House from holding hearings on
select committee is most necessary and substantive legislation dealing with codes
.important at this time. If for no other that we are informed concern themselves
reason than to dispel the fears and con with the C
t
l
en
ra
Intelligence Agency.
terns that so many of our citizens have Mr. GIAIMO. Does the gentleman
all over the countr
t
d
y
o
ay. mean the standing committees which mparusan select
My problem is that we deal with a hav
di -committee which it
j
i
ti
e
u r
s
c
onr seems to me this body number of governmental agencies; how- Mr. JOHN L. BURTON. Legislation and which the American people deserve.
ever, we do not deal at all with the mat-! dealing. with matters on the part of the Mr. Chairman, in expressing my sup-
b of local
ter ecause
the inolice. II na i services s question
tion Central Intelligence Agency and the cre- port for ' this general proposal, let me
ation of this committee does not mean, emphasize again that such action by
of the Baltimore City Police Department in fact, a moratorium on any others. the House should be of a truly bipartisan
kept dossiers on black elected officials, Mr. GIAIMO. I think it is the OPPO- and objective nature. Accordingly, I am
black clergymen, and black community site of that. In fact, I think the estab- hopeful that the action which we will.
leaders. These dossiers or reports were 'lishment of this legislation is going to take here today will reflect the kind of
forwarded to the Federal Bureau of In- give an impetus and encouragement to balance and objectivity which this sub-
vestigation, the Army Intelligence Agen- these other existing committees to play - ject deserves and which this House act-
cy, and to other governmental agencies. a greater role in oversight and legisla- ing`responsibly in the national interests
Is, that not also an important link tion in these areas than they have in the should take..
that should be looked at? past. Mr. Chairman, I am aware of the con-
Mr. GIAIMO. Mr. Chairman, I do not The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gen- tents of House Resolution 121, intro-
think that we should put into this legis- tleman from Connecticut has again duced' by our distinguished Republican
lation any authority empowering us to expired. leader, the gentleman from Arizona (Mr.
look into the activities of State Zr local. -. Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair- RHODES) which in my opinion sets forth
government; however, to take the ex- man
I yield 1 additional
i
t
t
,
m
nu
e
o more precisely the steps which this House
--ample that the gentleman propounds the gentleman from Connecticut (Mr. should take. In other words, I believe
where there was an involvement of the GIAIMO).
local police force and the Federal Bureau Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Chairman, will the on
the select committee should focus its ave o of Investigation or the LEAA, for ex- gentleman yield? been ct the abuses
our which may ha ve
ample, there is no question but that we Mr. GIAIMO. I yield to the gentleman e practiced by our intelligence Bathe
have the authority to look into the ac- from South Carolina. bring avoid jeopardizing the saran time, we
tivities of the FBI or the LEAA as far. as Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Chairman, I would should avoid eopardizing any and all
it relates to police departments. _ just like to associate myself with the re- hiies s intelligence
mpo to gathering do ial
Mr. MITCHELL of Maryland. Mr. marks of. the gentleman from Connecti- ies which are important to our national
Chairman, if the gentleman will yield cut. I believe he has very ably expressed security-perhaps even to our survival
further, am I right in assuming that we my concerns in detail on this task force* as a nation in a world in which many
are not considering the local police de- I would urge the adoption of the hostile and aggressive elements exist and
partment sacrosanct and, therefore, not resolution as it is presented and not where we rloca be alert to the danger
at this time involved in this question of amended. of global holocaust.
espionage? . Mr. MURI?HY of Illinois. Mr. Chair- Mr. Chairman, in addition to the pro
Mr. GIAIMO. This is not a question man, I have no further requests for time. aware aware also of House the a ammenndmeedee 121, I am
nts which I
of being sacrosanct. We'think we have a Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair- understand will be proposed by my col-
big enough job to look into the Federal man, I yield 4 minutes to the gentleman league from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON). In
agencies and whether or not they have from Illinois (Mr. MCCLORY). . my been involved in any wrongdoing. (Mr. McCLORY asked and was given t to o h th e measure these before us proposed -House se Re so-
which is involved in-House Resolu-
tion 138 is so all-encompassing that the
work of the proposed select committee
could go7 on- for,years. The minority
leader, the gentleman from Arizona (Mr.
RHODES), introduced House Resolution
121, and it seems to me that that pro-
posal directs its attention at the princi-
pal problem. with which we are con-
cerned; namely, the problem of jeopar-
dizing the rights of individual American
citizens by misuse of our intelligence
agencies.
That is a subject over which the House
Judiciary Committee, and now specific-
ally the Subcommittee on Civil Rights,
has general jurisdiction, and it is some-
thing with which that subcommittee is
vitally concerned on a continuing basis.
The broader mandate which we have
here, it seems to me, is going to involve
us in much more than that, as the earlier
colloquies have indicated. I intend to sup-
port the amendments to be offered by
the gentleman from Illinois (Mr. ANDER-
SON). It seems to me that all of those
amendments are essential if we are to
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 H 876-~` CONGRESSIONAL. RECORD- HOUSE Feb? uary 19, 1975 A rovVeed For RuEeelea~Trisge 2 n.0p~/0"~0L(`IA-{{~~rn 3 0(~ 8 ~(~0 7 4 -
Iution? 138-more pat curately carry o concius1on, lGfr. air3rran, Clr~s~rePs ighk,?~ the Qan ~3'a9e o %1 resolu-
the objectives which I feel are essential lution, if strengthened by the adoption tion and guard against the unauthorized
to a truly . bipartisan and objective. in-' of my colleague's amendments, is. worthy dissemination of information on matters
vestigation. . of the support of . every . Member who which are necessarily secret.
Mr. Chairman, it is important, first of wants a truly professional and bipartisan Mr. BAUMAN. Mr. Chairman, if the
all, that the composition of any such inquiry-in which the American ' people gentleman will yield further, would the -
select. committee should. be evenly di- can justifiably place their trust. A coun- gentleman's amendment apply also- to
vided between Republicans and Demo- try which has had its confidence shaken Members of the House as well?
crats. A proposed 10-member committee- in the integrity of its intelligence- agen- Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
evenly divided between Republicans and cies and which is concerned about the man, as written, the amendment applies
Democrats would carry out this goal. constitutional rights of its citizens being to staff; it does not specifically apply to
This is a matter of great concern to both. abridged, is in precarious. condition in- Members. I think in those instances .we
Republicans and Democrats alike-and deed. Let us act today, in the highest will have to, have faith in the- qualifica-
this inquiry will necessarily involve in- : tradition of this House, to show the tions of the MembpFs who iii?1l be selected
vestigations. of both Republican and. American people that we are prepared to to serve on that committee, and we will
Democratic administrations. A balanced deal with the serious problems which go have to have faith that they will ob-
bipartisan committee with equal repre to the heart of our form of government serve the kind of circumspection that will
sentation of both partieswould clearly-- by adopting my colleague from Illinois' be required of the members of that- com-.
be best equipped to deal with these im- . amendments and passing this important mittee.
portant and sensitive matters in a. re resolution- Mr.BAUMAN. Mr. Chairman; the, gen
sponsible manner. -Mr. ANDERSON. of Illinois. Mr. Chair- tleman has a large measure of faith.
Our colleague (Mr. ANDERSON) also will, man. I yield myself 3 additional minutes. Mr. - BIESTER. Mr. Chairman, as a
offer an amendment to require the select. Mr. Chairman, I want to thank the - sponsor of legislation in both the pre-
committee :to take the necessary steps.. gentleman from Illinois, my colleague, vious and present Congress to create a
to guard. the confidentiality of the ex, Mr.. MCCLORY, for -offering his support Joint. Cosnmittee on Intelligence,. I rise-
tremely sensitive material arid. informa for the amendments that I ?described in support of House Resolution 138 es-
tion with.which it will be dealing. Adop-- earlier. They are going to be offered, tablishing a Select Committee: on Intel-
tion of this amendment is absolutely nec- as I suggested, not with any desire to ligence.
essary if, the inquiry is to avoid leaks, frustrate the very important aims of. this I will vote. for this-bill with some mis-
which could. seriously jeopardize national: select committee when it is established, givings as I do not feel it is, the most
security.: but rather, I think, to undergird it with preferable wayto approach the problem.
Mr. Spea.ker, this amendment goes in a. kind of guarantee against partisanship Few would deny that the reports and al- -
tandem' with another amendment, to be.; that I think would be disastrous? so far legations involving illegal CIA and other -
offered by my friend from Illinois which as public confidence. Is concerned, or as foreign' intelligence activities demand
would. require appropriate security clear-? far as any meaningful results that, hope- the closest examination. It is question-
ances for. the select committee's staff. fully, would otherwise flow from its able, I feel, whether the. House. should
Furthermore, Section (C) of this amend- adoption. undertake to duplicate much of the same .
ment insures that no member of the staff - Mr. BAUMAN.-Mr. Chairman, will the. investigative - inquiry which is already
may use the classified information which gentleman yield? - being done by the President's commis-
he or she.. receives in the course of the. - Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to - sion and the Senate panel The proper
inquiry for later monetary gain-further the gentleman from Maryland. course for Congress to havetaken in this
minimizing the risk of security breaches. . Mr. BAUMAN. I note in section 6 the matter would have been to create a joint
after the filing of the select commit- committee is authorized to establish its House-Senate committeeiather than the
tee's report- and the completion of its own rules of procedure with regard to re- two, separate efforts we will have should
work. lease of information which may come House Resolution 138 pass. The House
Mr. Chairman, the concept of a single before this committee. If the gentleman should be-involved firsthand in an ex--
comprehensive bipartisan- inquiry, em--, will recall, in the impeachment inquiry amination of what has been done, and
bodied in this resolution, enjoys wide- of the Committee on the Judiciary, they for this reason the bill before us should
spread support. Because of the problems voted to close certain sessions, which pass.
of overlapping jurisdiction which exist in - they had the right to do. The next . The need for some form of. on-going
our committee structure with respect to morning, in the metropolitan. press the oversight mechanism is not satisfied by
oversight. of Federal intelligence activi- entire `contents of those hearings were the existence of these several groups, as.
ties, it is my feeling that this select com- on the front page in great detail, with- important- as their immediate objectives
mittee ought to preempt the separate in- out any names being revealed as to are. -1-believe we will still need to have a :
quiries by the standing committees of the whom the sources were. This- committee permanent body with the authority to.
House. To do. an adequate job, however,: will be dealing, with highly sensitive in- monitor what is happening in the area
the select committee deserves the set - formation in this investigation.: Was of foreign intelligence operations. Right
authorization of $750,000 which is -pro= there any testimony before the Commit- now that -authority is fragmented and,
vided by- Mr. ANDERSON'S third amend- tee on Rules or has- anyone offered any for practical. purposes, nonexistent. By
ment. This amendment should be sup- recommendations which will. protect -bringing together in one committee .
ported if we are serious in our desire to the secrecy of these investigations? Members from. both Houses-specifically
have a single intensive investigation in - Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I would including those who serve on Foreign Af-
the place of several duplicative, noncom- say to the gentleman that. I will offer an fairs and Foreign Relations, Armed'
prehensive inquiries. amendment on the subject he has raised Services and Appropriations-we will be
Finally, the fourth Anderson amend- and specify that rules and procedures better able to follow on a continuing '
ment-which sets a September 1, 1975, must be adopted by the committee that basis what is being done by our foreign
deadline for the select committee's re- are designed to prevent. the disclosure intelligence apparatus.
port-makes sense and ought to be sup- outside of the committee of information Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois has joined me
ported. We know that the Senate's select that is not. authorized to be disclosed,: In introducing H.R. 261, creating a Joint
committee will report on that date-and. and, furthermore, to establish security. Committee on Intelligence, and I hope
I believe that the House should also-in : clearance requirements for individuals consideration of such legislation will be -
the interests of a coordinated congres- who will be handling the sensitive mate- -forthcoming during this session. Unless
sional approach to these important is- Tials. we have a permanent vehicle institu-
sues. No responsible Member.would op- . I. would agree that they are more sen- tionalizing supervision over this aspect of
roblem will
the
vit
t
t
l
-
p
i
y,
a
ac
pose an extension of this deadline if it sitive, perhaps, than some of the mate- - . governmen
were warranted by further revelations'- rials that were before the Committee on return to trouble us in the future.
but for now, it is most important to strive , the Judiciary in, the recent impeachment . Mr. KASTENMEIFEt. Mr. Chairman, I .
for an expeditious and coordinated in- inquiry. But all kinds of materials- will rise in support of House Resolution 138,
quiry into the disturbing allegations' be dealt with in this committee. to create a Select Committee on Intel-
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 F'e iri(ary Pp d For R ? ~~0 jRDP ~ 0823R000700040031-3
H 87'7
Wlu7e -I have indicated, through my time since the Central Intelligence ligence community will, in the long run,
sponsorship of House Concurrent Res- Agency was created in 1947, signaling the security of this Nation
olution 18, the long-range congressional undermine the
uncontrolled growth of secret intelli- and its citizens.
need for a }
permanent joint House-Sen- Bence activities in the executive branch, The Select Committee on Intelligence
ate oversight committee on intelligence the House will have established an ef- can play a major role in the preservation
activities, I believe it is essential that we fective mechanism to scrutinize ques- of our "national security" in this broad
immediately begin an investigation of tionable intelligence operations.
the costly and little known segments of sense. While I regret that it taken As.cne of the original sponsors of the House so long to recognize the nthe
need for
the Federal Government, our intelligence Select Corplmittee proposal, as well as a. this committee, I commend the Democra-
agencies, and measure their activities member of the ad hoc committee which tic leadership for finally supporting this
against their respective charters. unanimously recommended this resolu-, much needed reform. I urge passage of
The creation of a select committee to tion, I wish to summarize my under- , this resolution so that the select commit-
examine the specific agencies, as well as standing of the nature and scope of the tee can begin its long-overdde investiga-
the overall .conduct and responsibilities proposed select committee's authority. tion of the intelligence comm
of the entire -intelligence community is
it
'
un
y.
The committee
s major task will be to Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair.:
an iralportant.undertaking. Such an in- recommend whatever new legislation and man, I have no further requests for
quiry is long overdue. The demands that oversight structures are needed to in- time.
`the House assume its responsibility for sure--that intelligence agencies are op- Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
overseeing the intelligence agencies, grating within the law and are account- man, I have no further requests for time.
which operate largely in secrecy, can no able to Congress. This necessarily re- - The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read.
longer be ignored. quires a reconsideration of the policies .
- Obviously the Nation needs. effective and assumptions underlyin
u present The Clerk read as the a follows:
criminal surveillance programs. No one telli ence practice. It requires ar in- hed in That (a) there is hereby estab-
criminal cis utes this
' g careful
P
e in the House of
and there i
Sul
,
s no
a
investigation into all - intellegence ac- . Select Committee on intelligence prese to in the Conges-who would work to- tivitiaa - ---
waau uriuerrrnning time effectiveness of
our intelligence agencies in the perform-
ance of their- necessary and legitimate
functions.
However, It is the responsibility of
the Congress to define the legitimate
intelligence activities, establish- guide-
lines for the -conduct of ? such operations
and insure that such guidelines. are_ en-
forced: We have evidence of thilitary
a~cuw Spying on civilians: It has been
acknowledged that- the CIA became in-
volved in domestic -surveillance. Testi-
mony before various congressional com-
mittees indicates that intelligence. agen-
cies have withheld information from
the Congress and have engaged in seri-
ous abuses and misuses of authority.
These are matters which must be fully
..and thoroughly explored.
As recent testimony before .the House
Judiciary Subcommittee of -which I am
chairman -indicates, the surveillance
techniques of domestic intelligence
agencies are equally worthy of scrutiny.
We have evidence that warrantless
wiretaps were conducted for as long as
25 years. We have admissions that the
FBI monitored some 40 phone calls be-
tween one Detroit lawyer and his clients.
We have evidence that the Secret Serv-
Ice had access without legal process to
very revealing telephone toll records. We
have information that the FBI used
private bank and credit records without
any legal authority. We have reports of
FBI spying on Members of Congress and
domestic political groups including ac-
tual disruption of political associations.
Mr. Chairman, we have reached a
point where the public's confidence in
the Nation's law. enforcement agencies is
legitimately shaken. A thorough house
cleaning of the intelligence community
will go a long way toward restoring that
confidence.
I urge adoption of House Resolution
138 and the speedy selection of the House
Select Committee on Intelligence.
Mr. HARRINGTON. Mr. Chairman,
the resolution to create a House Select
Committee on Intelligence represents a
vital first step toward making this
Nation's intelligence community ac-
countable to the Congress for the first
abroad or in violations of the civil lib- community ~~+lseent. of the United States Govern-,
-
erties of American citizens. Finally, it meat.
requires an evaluation of the past ef- (b) The select committee shalt be com-
ed of ten Mem
fectiveness of House intelligence over- reessen
tatives. to be apes of appointed by House of Rep-
sight committees in keeping these-agen- in consultation with the chairmen of those
ties within legal bounds. The select con- standing committees having current juris-<
mittee proposed today would have au-> diction over Intelligence matters., , The_
thority to accomplish these tasks. Speaker shall designate one of the Members.
My, support for the select commit- as chairman.'
tee stems in large part from my belief (c) For the purposes of this resolution ,
that existing controls on intelligence ac-- the select committee is authorized to sit'
tivities, particulalry on the CIA, have during sessions s the House and dhe H the
ouse'
been wholly inadequate. Specifically, the has srecesssed or aad) urneed. A ma majority of-t
he
CIA's secret program In Chile to de- members of the'select committee shall con-
stabilize the Allende government have stitute a quorum for'the transaction of bus!--
yet to be subjected to searching con- - ness except that the select committee may
gressional inquiry. Likewise, the extent designate a lesser number as a quorum for the -
of CIA domestic surveillance has not purpose of taking testimony- -
been fully examined. The .House Select COMMITTEE AMENDMENT ? .
Committee on Intelligence would be im- The CHAIRMAN, The Clerk Will re-
powered, along with- its more general port the first committee -amendment.
investigations, to explore these particu- The Clerk read as follows:'
lar intelligence activities. Committee amendment: On page 1, line 8,
It is important to realize that intel- after the word "Speaker" insert a period and
ligence policies and covert operations are- strike out all after the period through the
not established without official actions at word "matters." on page 1, line 10.
the highest levels of the executive branch..: The committee amendment was agreed :
Any complete study of the intelligence to
community must probe the mechan- AMENDMENT OZTEEED BY Y. M. ANDERSON OF
isms within the executive branch, es-
pecially the National Security Council, mm Fors
for
for initiating and controlling intelligence Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
Amendment offered by Mr. ANDERSON of
with its subpena power, the committee
would be able to obtain valuable testi Illinois: On page 1, strike lines 0 through
moray from all executive branch officials 11 and insert in lieu thereof the following:
who deal with intelligence policy. "posed (d) The select
eps rs of the ttee s Hoouusse of o Rom-
It has been warned in debate over this r sentati es to be- appointed p aker
proposal that care should be taken to as follows: (1) five from hemjothe n Speaker
Protect the "national security" interests -and (2) five from the minority party,
of the United States. I agree. However, y eader of oafter
f consultation with the minorit
this country's security depends just as House" The Speaker shall designate one of
much on the maintenance of a rule of the Members as chairman."
law as it does on the preservation of - (Mr
ANDERSON
f
.
o
Illinois asked and
diplomatic secrets. It is threatened just was given permission to revise and ex-
as seriously by a misguided covert inter- tend his rerpaarks.)
ventiqu abroad as it is by insufficient in- M
r ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
man, gathering and analysis. ,Na- .
man, this amendment specifies that the
tional security" means much more than composition of the select committee shall
mere acquiesence by Congress to asserted be completely bipartisan, with five Mem-
claims of necessity by intelligence offi- bers from the majority party and five
ciais. Such an abdication of congressional from the minority party. The resolution -
responsibility and control over the Intel- as reported contains no specific refer-
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 H 878-. Approved For- ftftRe,4WI1.QE/ C 0823R(bTAy0lft 1t8 T5--.
to the partisan makeup of the com-- 9 to 1 or 10 to 0 undess we spell out the to establish a select committee. It is this
mittee, but it was made clear in our Rules` ratio as to the members of the commit- institution which is going to conduct the. .
Committee hearings that the Democratic tee; is that correct? oversight and the investigation of the
Caucus rule of 2 to 1 plus 1 would apply Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair- alleged impairment of the rights of in-
to the select committee as well. That man, the gentleman is quite correct. But dividual citizens,' by -reason of illegal,
I want to immoral, and unethical activities alleged
ide
th
,
er s
would mean, on a.10-member committee in fairness to the o
such as this, there would be 7 Democrats say that they made it quite clear in their -to have Been carried out by the intelli-
and only-3 Republicans. testimony in the Committee on Rules Bence-gathering agencies and,, conse-
Mr. Chairman, I think it Is especially that a 7 to 3 ratio is what they intended.....quently, it seems to me that we should
important that this committee-having. This was the decision of the task force, do this in a responsible, objective man
such broad- authority to probe such sensi- appointed by the Democratic Policy ner through the establishment of a select
tive areas spanning Republican and Steering Committee after it had been committee which will be even balanced
Democratic. administrations alike-that referred to that group by the Democratic between the majority and the minority
- - -
this committee be completely bipartisan Caucus. Therefore, I am satisfied that parties.,
so that there is not one hint of partisan- it is going to be 7 and 3 unless we adopt . I want to assure those who are oppos-
ship. I think we should recall that in the this amendment. - ing this amendment on the other side of
last Congress we created a bipartisan . I think,- nevertheless, that the reasons the aisle of our sincere interest on this
select committee of five -Democrats and I have given are good and sufficient rea- side of the aisle of doing the kind of
five Republicans to investigate this sons why we ought to specify an even thorough job, not only with respect to- -
House and its committees. That commit- division?in the membership of the com- this administration, but with respect to
tee worked quite well together, and mittee. - prior administrations, and we, do not
unanimously reported a comprehensive Mr. GIAIMO. Mr. Chairman, I rise in- want to have any coverup of any earlier
and constructive product.. It. put par-' opposition to the amendment. ? . activities, which certainly could result,
tisanship aside and acted in what it con- .(Mr. GIAIMO asked and was, given if the control is there and the political
sidered to be the best interests of the permission to revise and extend his re- interest respect there, to. an otectraad to cover
House. It would seem doubly important marks.) - r up with Consequently, I believe that if vr-
?that we adopt this nonpartisan approach [Mr. GIAIMO addressed the Commit- tion. truly tly bell v tat ob-
to investigating the intelligence com- tee. His remarks will appear hereafter in are re t .oe
e and truly responsible tl the
munity so that-the committee will act in the Extensions of Remarks.] American people in connection with this.-
the best interests of the country. Mr. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, I make select committee, we should support
I would also point out that our own ' the point of order that a quorum is not. overwhelmingly the amendment offered
biofpartisar On- present. by my colleague, the gentleman from -
c ia1 Conduct is Committee on completely Standards
with complletely bipartisan, pThe CHAIRMAN. Evidently a quorum Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON). - - - - -
cans. if efee w should six Repuban is not present. - I hope the House will give that kind
. l we should be nonpartisan . The Chair announces that he will va- of support to this amendment.'
in n investigating feeand policing the conduct
roceedings under the call when a -- Mr. RHODES. Mr. Chairman, I move
te
ca
p
of House Members, it should follow that
we would want to be nonpartisan 'in in- quorum of the Committee appears. to strike the requisite number of words.
vestigating and policing our domestic. Members will record their presence by -' (Mr. RHODES asked and was given -
communities-- electronic device. - - ' permission to revise and extend his-
and an even foreign more delicate and intelligence nd sensitive area. The ? call was -taken by electronic remarks.)
device. --Mr. RHODES. Mr. Chairman, the gen-
The Senate select committee co posi- - QUORUM "CALL VACATED tieman from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON) has
tion, with a neatly oats -sandd c five ve Re- The CHAIRMAN. One hundred Mem- offered four amendments, all of which
n si x Democrats an
pun,
publicans, , "despite the fact that the hers have appeared: A quorum of the. I think would be a great improvement-
majority party has a 3-to-2 ratio in that Committee of the Whole is present. Pur- to this bill. I am particularly interested
body. suant to rule XXIII, clause 2, further in the amendment which would change"
I have reviewed the numerous resolu- proceedings under the call shall be con- the composition of the committee so that
tions referred to our Rules Committee sidered as vacated. it would be equal between the parties.
which would establish either House se- - The Committee will resume its Select committees, without legislative
lect or joint committees on intelligence. business. authority, should be bipartisan. They are
Almost all 'of' them, introduced by Re- Mr. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, I move - customarily evenly, or nearly - evenly
publicans and Democrats alike, would to strike the requisite number of words,. divided between the parties and- I think
have either a bipartisan or. nearly bi- and I rise in support of the amendment this precedent followed in both Houses -
partisan composition. offered by the gentleman from Illinois should not be abandoned.
And yet, here we have a resolution (Mr. ANDERSON). I recognize the ability of the Demo-
drafted in the Democratic Steering and (Mr. McCLORY asked. and was given' cratic side,' and' of the -Democratic:
Policy Committee which would revert to permission to revise and extend his re- caucus, to impose its will upon - the
the old partisan ratio of 2 to 1 plus one. marks.) House. It has the votes to do it, and if
I can understand that such a proposal is Mr. McCLORY. .Mr. Chairman, it it wants to do it, it certainly can, but
to be expected from one of the partisan seems to me that if the majority party I ask the members on my right to think
organs in the "House. But we -are, now wants to act in a responsible and a bi- ahead to the possible time when the
and I ask
rities might be different
aj
,
o
a.ting as an institution-not as Republi- partisan manner, they can achieve that m
cans or Democrats-but as Members of end through the acceptance . of this them if they think it would be. a good
Congress . interested in doing what is amendment. I might say that in support- idea for. a select committee to -be" set up
this body which would be seven to
b
y
right for the country and in doing it the ing the general thrust of this resolution
right way. And I would suggest that we and the establishment of a Select Com- three..
must act on a matter of this importance mittee, I am just as interested in the' ? I also ask them if they think it is a
and sensitivity in.such a way that there activities of such a select committee as good idea to change precedent so that.
not even be the appearance of partisan- any Member on the other side of the aisle., the majority party is in complete control.
ship connected with this investigation. I I think there is the suggestion or the im- of something which is as sensitive as the
this 7 to 3 ratio which sug- investigation of the intelligence divisions-
amendment
of m
ti
i
ti
d
y
on
n
. plica
op
on
urge a
'[r. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, will gests this is going to be a partisan at- " of our Government today. It seems to me
the gentleman yield? tack and a partisan effort. Certainly par-. that this is such a sensitive operation,
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. I yield to than control of this activity should not _ such a sensitive area, that the Members
the gentleman from Illinois. " - be patterned after a legislative function. of the majority party would be well.
Mr. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, . actu- I think the integrity of this institution, served if a committee to perform this -
ally the resolution before us does not the House of Representatives, is in- very delicate task were to be just. as bi-.
provide for' any ratio; it provides for a volved in this very amendment, because partisan as anybody could, possibly
10-member committee, and it could be this institution is the one which is going make it. .
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 9800823R00.07000400W839
,eb j 193A Eoved Fong (~9 0 1 AmF
I understand partisanship is quite the Heckler; Mass- McKinney. Shriver Slack Teague Wilson;
vogue in this Congress, and again that Heinz Madigan .. Shuster Smith, Iowa -Thompson. Charles H.,
Hillis Martin Sikes Solarz Thornton Calif.
is the prerogative of the majority party Hinshaw Michel ' Smith, Nebr. Spellman Traxler Wilson, Mill
S
Snyder
Tson to make it SO if it desires to do so. But Horton M iter,cheOhio N.Y. - Spence St nton, Udall as With Ies, Tex-
.
I also suggest that this investigation s Hutchinson Moore,. Stanton, James V. " Ullman Wolf
necessary. I agree that it is. I am pleased Hyde Mosher -? J. William Stark Van Deerlin Wright :'- -'
that it is. going to be done by- a select' Jeffords . Myers, Ind. Steelman Stephens Vander Veen 'Yates
committee instead of ' by various other.- Johnson, Colo. Myers, Pa. Steiger, Ariz. _ Stokes Vanik Yatron
Johnson; Pa. O'Brien Steiger, Wis. Stratton Vigorito Young, Ga.
committees . in which there would be Kasten' ' Peyser Symms Stuckey waggonner Young, Tex:
- - -- "- --? . Stmida Warman Zablockt
i
t
-
t
en
-aayior, N.C. b
it seems to me the people, the citizens Lagomarsino Quillen - Walsh -
of the Republic, would feel much better Latta Railsback - Wampler NOT VO=G-26 .
about the whole thing and would feel Lent Regula Whalen
Riegle n
h m Lott Rhodes Whitehurst
confident about the findings Lujan Rinaldo Wiggins ns . Bear Beard, d, R.I. Ford, Foley Tenn..' iegle
muc
of this committee-that there would not McClory Robinson - Winn Bergland Fulton Rose
be a witch hunt-if the members of the McCloskey Rousselot . Wydler Biaggi Jarman Schulze
d
eeS
Chappell -
Wyl
Rister u
pee
?
c
1
-
Steed
a. -
cDade
ng,Alaska Clawson,
Del Leggett
Youn
committee -were. evenly divided between ,1
Sarasi
Mad
Fla. : Diggs Mills - Talcott -.
ld Schneebeli - Young
.. ' "
D
,
ona
- Mc
the parties.
So, Mr. Chairman, ,I speak for all of McEwen Sebelius - Downing - Moorhead, .Taylor Mo: -
Eilberg - Calif. Wiison,Bob.-
he
..
man from Illinois, and I particularly Melcher
address myself to the one involving the, Ad Adams - Florio Flowers Metcalfe The result of the vote was announced _
content of--the committee. Alexander Flynt Meyner as above recorded.
Mr: BRODHEAD. Mr., Chairman, I - Ambro Ford, Mich:- Mezvinsky The CHAIRMAN: The Clerk will read.
move to strike the requisite number of Anderson, Fountain-. Mikva The Clerk read as follows: -. ,;-,? -
Calif. Fraser Milford
words- and I rise in opposition to the Andrews, x.c: T Fuqua Miner, Calif. SEC. 2. The select committee Is authorized
amendment.,- Annunzio Gaydos Mineta and directed to conduct an. inquiry: into-
(Mr: BRODHEAD asked and was given Ashley . Giaimo Minish (1) the collection, analysis, use, and cost
Aspin Gibbons Mink of intelligence information and allegations
permission to revise and extend his AuCoin Ginn Mitchell, nid. 'of.. improper activities of. Intelligence, agen-
remarks.) Badnlo Gonzalez Moakley Cesln the United States and abroad;
Mr. BRODIiA. 1VIr. Chairman, it Bau us Green Moffett the procedures and effectiveness of co
(2)
Hal
e
e
i
ous
ordination among and between the var
Bedell ll -
- . Montgomery mery
Hall
seems to me that the _amendment to B
make this committee evenly divided be- Bevill 'Hamilton --' . Moorhead, Pa. - intelligence components of the United States
Hanley - Morgan - Government;
Bingham
.
tween the two parties would have the
Blanchard Hannaford . Moss (3) the nature and extent of, executive
effect of to be trying to reverse the re- Blouin Harkin Mottl branch oversight and control, of United-
sults of the last election. If the People Boggs Harrington Murphy, M. States intelligence activities;.
-wanted the- responsibilities -to- be divided Boland - Harris - - Murphy, N.Y.
Bolling - Hawkins- ,:- Murtha (4) the, need for improved or reorganized -
50-50 between the two parties they would Booker -, Hayes, Ind. - Hatcher oversight by the Congress of United States
have voted that-way. They did not. They Bowen Hays, Ohio Neal intelligence activities; -
-voted two-thirds for one party and one- Brademas' - Hechler, W. Va. Nedzi .(5) the necessity, nature, and extent of
third- for the other. I do not understand Br Helper Nichols overt and covert -intelligence activities by
why the minority is trying to obstruct Brodhead Henderson t HersNix - Nolan United States intelligence Instrumentalities
in theUnited States and abroad;
the work of -this House by, offering such Brooks Hicks - Nowak ;
an 'amendment with - respect to this Brown, Calif. Hightower Oberstar - (6) the procedures for and means of the -
Burke, Calif. Holland - Obey protection of sensitive Intelligence informa--
committee... Burke, Mass. Holtzman . O'Hara - flop; and ;
The CHAIRMAN. The question is on Burleson, Tex. Howard O'Neill (7) such other related matters as the se-
the amendment offered by-the gentleman Burleson, Mo. Howe Ottinger. lest committee shall deem necessary to' carry
from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON). - Burton, Phillip oillhillip Hughes sd Patte Patten n out the purposes of this resolution.::
He - . '
The question was taken; - and the- Byron Hungate. Patterson, Calif. . cossairrrEE AMENDMENTS
Chairman announced that the noes ap- 'Carney Ichord Pattison, N.Y. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will re-
Carr, Jacobs Pepper
peered to have it. Casey Jenrette Perkins port the next committee amendment.
clay Jones, Ala. Pike Committee amendment: On 2, line 12,
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Collins, ni, Jones, N.C.- - Poage ? _ _ _-_ page
P
i
r
1 g 1 .' ' Y
A recorded vote was ordered. Gorman Jones, -- - ? .
The vote was taken by electronic de- Cornell Jordan _ Randall
cotter Barth Bengal . The - committee ~ amendment was
vice; and there were-ayes 141, noes 265, D'Amours Kastenmeler - Rees agreed to.
not voting 26, as follows: Daniel, Dan Hazen Reuss D ieIs Keys Richmond The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will re-
Abdnor
Abzug
Anderson, Ill.
Andrews,
N. Dak.
Archer
Armstrong
]R011 No. 17] Dominick V. Koch Risenhoover port the next committee amendment.-
AYES-141 Danielson Krebs Roberts The Clerk read as follows:
Davis Krueger - Rodino Committee amendment: On page 3, line 2,
Carter .. _Erlenborn de Is Garza Lapalce - Roe
Cederberg Esch Delaney ? Landrum . Rogers strike out the word "and" and insert the-fol-
Clancy Eshleman Dellums Lehman Roncalio lowing: -
Clausen, Fenwick Dent Levitas Rooney "(7) procedures for and means of the pro- -
Don H. Findley - Derrick - Litton Rosenthal tection of rights and privileges of citizens of
Cleveland Fish - Dingell Lloyd, Calif.' Rostenkowski the United States from illegal or,improper
Cochran Forsythe Dodd Lloyd, Tenn. Roush i t n;eo, a nrt;vifiwa? and'.
Bafalia ' Collins, Tex. - Frey . -
Bauman - Conable Gilman
Beard, Tenn: Conlau Goldwater
Bell Conte -' Goodling
Bennett Coughlin Gradison.
Biester - ` Crane Grassley
Breckinridge - ` Daniel, Robert Gude
Broomfield - W., Jr. Guyer
Brown, Mich. Derwinski Hagedorn
Brown, Ohio Devine - Hammer-
Broyhill Dickinson schmldt
Buchanan - Duncan, Tenn: Hansen
Burgener -du Pont Harsha
Burke, Fla. Edwards, Ala. Hastings ,
Butler Emery . , - Hebert
-
Duncan, Oreg. McCormack Russo Ingly. '
Early McFall - Ryan -
Eckhardt McHugh - St Germain - The committee amendment was
Edgar McKay
Ed wards,. Calif. Macdonald
English " Madden -
Evans, Colo. ' Maguire
Evans, Ind. Mahon
Sarbanes - The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. -
Satterfield
- ' The Clerk read as follows:
-- - --
Schrue uer - :
Schroeder SEC 3. In carrying* out the purposes of
Evins, Tenn. Mann - Seiberling
Fascell. . Mathis - - ? Sharp
Fisher Matsunaga Shipley -
Fithian Mazzoli ,. - _ . Simon
Flood - Weeds Sisk
this resolution, the select committee is au
thorized to Inquire into the activities- of
(1) the National Security Council; --
(2) the United States Intelligence Board;
Approved For Release 2000/09/03 :,-CIA-RDP83B00823R000700040031-3-
 ved For ReleC?ST9 AJ?~ 'L ?4 3R0007df4nn. -?ij
A
r
' j '
(
np
g
;-
3) the s den 's Foreign Intelligence propriate, security clearance as determined ' twill. But AS a bare minimum, I think
Advisory-Board; by the select committee. The type of security
(4) the Central Intelligence Agency; clearance to be required in the case of any these safeguardsshould be clearly. stated
(5) the Defense Intelligence Agency; such employee or person shall, within the de- by the full House: Given the nature of
(6) the intelligence components of the termination of the select committee, be com- the investigation, we cannot -abide any
Departments of the Army, Navy, and Air mensurate with the sensitivity of the classi- leaks springing from this con,.mittee.
Force; fled-information to -hick such employee or Recent
(7) the National Security Agency; person will be. y Past experiences with staff leaks
(8) the, Intelligence and Research Bureau committee. given access by the select should be sufficient' in impressing on
of the Department of State; "(c) As a condition for em to us the need for-this body to make the
(9) the Federal Bureau of Investigation; scribed in section 5 of this resolution, ach concerns and desires of the gall House
(10). the- Department of the Treasury; person shall agree not to accept any honorar-
(11) membership explicit in this regard.
the Energy Research and Develop- ium, royalty, or other payment for a speak- The conduct of this investigation will
nrent Administration; and ing en
(12) any other instrumentalities of the th gagemenr magazine article, book, or be a reflection on the entire Hortse
sifted materials and national secrets. I .??`? ANDERSON OF
ILLINOIS
would stress at the outset that this ran- - Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
guage is identical to that contained in man, I offer an amendment.. -
Senate Resolution 21 as adopted, estab- . The Clerk read as follows:
lisping the Senate select committee on Amendment offered by Mr. ANDERSON of
intelligence. As the resolution before us Illinois: On page 5, after line 2, insert the
reads, the committee shall establish following new section and redesignate sec-
whatever rules and procedures it deems tions 7 and 8 as sections 8 and 9, respectively:
appropriate to protect such informs- "SEC. 7. The expenses of the select com-
tion. mittee under this resolution shall not exceed
My amendment simply elaborates on $750,000. of which, amount not. to exceed
this by specifying that such. rules and merit of the shall be available for, the services of individual consult nts'
procedures should be designed to prevent or organizations thereof. Such expenses shall
the disclosure outside-the committee of be paid from the contingent fund of the _
any information not authorized to be dis- Rouse upon vouchers signed by the` chair-
closed by the committee, and to prevent - man of the select committee and approved
the disclosure of information which by the Speaker,"
would adversely affect any of our foreign . (Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois asked and
intelligence activities. was given permission to revise and ex-
Moreover, the amendment requires that tend his remarks.) -
the committee establish security clear- Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
ance requirements for staff people haw- man, this amendment simply sets an ex-
ing access to classified r taterlals, as the pense ceiling of $750,000 for the - select '
committee determines is commensurate committee, along with a subceiling of
with the sensitivity of the information e,
c___
00 000
as
~- ono employment, start pet- guage In the Senate-passed resolution. . .
Institute and carry out such rules and pro- We assigned to the committee, as well as
In questioning witnesses on this matter
cede es as It may deem necessary to prevent outside consultants . working With. the yesterday in Rules, no estimate was given , outside mittthe disclosure
committee, agree not to accept an
any information rel
ti
a
y p
a
ng to he
y- on what the select Committee might cost.
activities of the Central Intelligence Agency neat, royalty or honorarium for speak-.Select
gentleman from. Michigan, -"(Mr.
or any other department or agency of .the g engagement, book, .article or other. NEDZI) said he didn't think it would cost
-Federal Government engaged In intelligence endeavor in connection. with his or her, as-much as the Senate investigation; de-
activities, obtained by the select committee work on the committee. Again, I would spite the fact that this is due t
during the course of its study and
invests-, st
t
.
ress,
o run 4 -
his language is identical to that months more.than the Senate inquiry. it
gation. not authorized by the select com- contained in the Senate-passed resolu- was also stated that the amount would
mitte'e to be disclosed;-and (2} the dlsclo-' flop:
sure, ' outside the select committee, of any be negotiated with the House Administra-
information which would adversel
Chairman
affect Mr
hil
.
y
, w
e I do not doubt tion Committee.
the intelligence artt"it'es ('f- the central that any such committee would establish well I do not like the idea of jumping
Intelligence Agency in foreign countries or necessary safeguards to protect sensitive -into something without having any idea
the intelligence activities in .foreign coun- information, i think it is important that how much
cost. In the last Con-
the tries of Federal any other department or agency of it Will we in the House impose some minimal gress, when :we established the Select
"(b) No employee of the select committee guidelines and requirements from the Committee - on: Committee Reform, the
or any person engaged by contract or other- very outset in order to give guidance to resolution creating that committee; as re-
wise to perform services for the select com- the committee. There Is certainly noth- ported from-the Rules Committee; con-
mitteeshall be given access to any classified ing in this amendment which would pre- tamed an authorization level.
information by.the select committee unless -.elude the committee from adopting other There is no reason whatsoever why we
such employee or person has received an ap- rules in this area, and I am sure they cannot set such a ceiling in this resolu-
Approved. For Release 2000/09/03 CIA-RDP83B00823R000700040031-3
. i 880
g
en
permission to revise and ex- - amendment. - - -
SEC. 4. The select committee may require, tend his remarks.) The CHAIRMAN. The question~is on
by subpena or otherwise, the attendance Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois, Mr. Chair- the amendment offered by the gentle-
and testimony of such witnesses and the
production of such books, records, corre- man, this amendment is aimed at detail- man from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON).
snnn A?nrn -.... a??~- --- - _ inn anA ~1?ro....+ti......:.-~ ~L- ----. _ mom- - ..
"Si"
o er endeavor connected with the investi- as such, we must accept full responsibility
United States Government engaged in or, gation and study undertaken by this coin- now for insuring that the investigation
otherwise responsible for Intelligence opera-
mittee " ...
tions in the United States and abroad. does not become either a Roman circus
comurrTEE AMENDMENT Mr. ANDERSO'' of Illinois (during or a sieve for-national - secrets-. I urge
The CHAIRMAN, The Clerk will re- the reading). Mr. Chairman, I ask unani- adoption of my amendment; '
Port the last committee amendment. ' mous consent that further reading of the Mr. MURPHY of Illinois, Mr. Cheir-
Th,t Clerk read follaamendment be dispensed with and that. man, will the gentleman yield?
Committee amendmen: it be printed in the,RECORD. Mr. ANDERSON of ' Illinois. I am
stoe out the semicolon and page the follow- . 1, The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to pleased to yield-to the
in the request of the (Mr. MURPHY) : gentleman from
g: out the Department of Justicegentleman from Illi- Illinois
The committee amendment was agreed, to, nois. - - - Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
There was no objection. man, in a spirit of democratic coopers-
The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. (Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois asked and tion, our side will accept the gentleman's -
The Clerk read as follows: was
iv
aaoa:c~ary. ouopenas
may be issued over the signature of the
chairman of the select committee. or any
member designated' by him, and may be
served by any person designated by the
chairman or such member. The chairman of
the select-committee. or any member desig-
nated by him, may administer oaths to any
witness.
SEC. 5. To enable-the select committee to
carry out the purposes of this resolution, it
is authorized to employ investigators, at=
torneys, consultants, or organizations
thereof,' and clerical, stenographic, and
other assistance.
SEC. 6. The select committee shall establish
and implement such -rules and procedures as
it may deem necessary to prevent the un-
authorized disclosure of information and
teetimony taken in executive session or ob-
tained by other means.
AMENDMENT OFFERED BY AIR. ANDERSON' OF
ILLINOIS .,
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois.' Mr.
Chairman, I ,offer an amendment.
The Clerk read as follows: -
Amendment offered by Mr. ANDERSON of
Illinois: On page 4, strike lines 23. through
.24 and on page 5 strike lines i and 2 and
 Februai'm 19 1975' CONGRESSIONAL ' REC RD -HOUSE 8 1
tion. Moreover, Approved en For Release OOO/09/03 tinitIA=RDP83B008o 23R0007000400b3ers 1-o3 the
out to the mem
of this investigation, covering-as it does should act- together. as soon as possible Committee that we have taken precau-
every agerlcy of the Federal Governm'ent' on doing this. There can. be no excuse tions here to see to it that.the select com-
having anything to do with intelligence- for dragging out the House investigation mittee is limited in duration to, the end
and broadly defined, "intelligence" Sim- 4 months beyond that of the Senate, and, of this year, January 31,- 1976. It is not
ply means - information ..gathering-I in the meantime delaying necessary and our intention nor our desire to perpetu-
think it is important at the outset that we possibly- joint action on this. problem. I . ate the Select Committee on-Intelligence
establish an overall 'dollar ceiling so that would add, , parenthetically, that I sus- year after year after year. At the same.
the committee :win- be forced to set its pect a recommendation may be made to time-and I am sure that my good friend,
priorities immediately and- get on with ,establish a Joint Committee on Intelli- the gentleman from Illinois, will agree
the most' important aspects of such. an 'Bence-Oversight; and, for that reason, it with me-we want to assure the commit-
investigation' I suspectahat if the com- is imperative that we'act promptly and -.tee sufficient time to do a creditable job
mittee did everything he could do under jointly. and proper investigation in this area . of
its authority in this resolution, the in- 1\/Ir. Chairman, I know that argument intelligence activities. We t}iink that the
vestigation could run for, years and cost will be made that there. is no way our,
the taxpayers millions. AS I-mentioned in: -committee can carfy out it. assignment
the Rules Committee, this could turn out under- this resolution in just 6 months. I
to be the biggest fishing_ expedition- since have no doubt that it could take from
-Moby Dick. I. do not think that is -what now until doomsday to do a thorough
'most Members'of this body want: We are 'job of iriplementing its'mandate.:But of
.primarily concerned with the more glar- supreme.importance, . it seems to me, is
jng and disturbing allegations of illegal that this committee. address itself to the
and improper .intelligence activities and most glaring and immediate allegations
.operations. And we want this committee before it, and then ttfrn over the rest to-
to .report back as soon as possible On a more permanent mechanism of the -
what steps the executive- and Legislative' Congre
ss to continue with.:Thi?'?is at
branches might take to strengthen their we should have been doing all along, and
control and oversight over the intelli- . I do not think we have to wait 11 months
gene community. fora select committee to tell us that. We
Mr. Chairman, just -as other commit- should move as soon as possible to estab-
-tees are required to report the expected lishing.- such a permanent mechanism
cost of programs they recommend, I and get on with the- job.
think we have an. obligation to require In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, I think
the same. of our own in-house activities this reporting deadline is in the best in-
by setting such cost parameters. Iurge terests- of the 'Congress and the Nation
adoption of my amendment. in establishing, within the Congress a
-Mr.-,MURPHY 'of Illinois. _Mr.. Chair- permanent . mechanism for conducting
man, will the gentleman yield? ` continuing review and oversight of the
Mr. ANDERSON .of Illinois. I am de- - intelligence community. Let us move- to
lighted' to yield to the, gentleman from gather with the other body, on thesame
Illinois. timetable and deadline in accomplishing
Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair- that larger end.
-man, in a. further demonstration of that I urge adoption of my amendment.
same spirit of conciliation and coopera- Mr. Chairman, I do not see the gentle-
'tion; we. will:accept the amendment on man from Illinois, my colleague on the
this side. ; committee, rising, " asking me to yield,
The CHAIRMAN. The question is on so-I must assume that the same spirit of
the.amendment offered by. the gentleman conciliation and cooperation does not
.. prevail` on this fourth and final amend-
from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON).
The amendment was agreed to. . meet that I offer to _ House 'Resolution
The. CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. 138, but I now yield to the gentleman
The Clerk read as follows: from Illinois in the hope that the gentle-
SEC. 7. The select committee is-authorized man has changed his mind after listen-
,and' directed to report to the House with re- iiig to my remarks.
spent to the-matters covered by this resolu- ' Mr. MURPHY of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
tion as soon as-practicable but no later than man, I must say to my colleague, the
January 31, 1976.
-AMENDMENT OFFERED BY MB. ANDERSON OF gentleman from Illinois-(Mr. ANDERSON)
ILLINOIS that the same spirit of conciliation and
. cooperation that. prevailed with regard
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr.. Chair to the other amendments does not pre-
man, I offer an amendment. vail in regard to this amendment.
The Clerk read as follows: Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair-
Amendment offered by Mr. ANDERSON of man, I regret that the gentleman from
-Illinois: On page 6, strike all of line 6 and Illinois -does' not .have the same feeling
insert. in lieu thereof the following: of conciliation and cooperation with re-
tember 1, 1976.^ spect to this amendment, but, regardless
(Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois asked alid of where we' stand on the political aisle,
was given permission -to revise and ex- I would invite the support of the gentle-
tend his remarks.) - - - man for the amendment because I con-
Mr. ANDERSON of Illinois. Mr. Chair- sider that it is in the interest of getting
- man, this amendment would change the the kind of an investigation that we want
reporting deadline for the select commit- = on both sides of the political aisle. .
tee from January 31, 1976 to September " Mr. GIAIMO. Mr Chairman, I rise in
:1,-1975. Again, the deadline contained in 'opposition to the amendment offered by
my amendment is identical to that of the the gentleman from Illinois (Mr. ANDER-
Senate committee. And I think for a very soN)'. .
obvious and practical reason. If both of - ' (Mr. GIAIMO asked and was 'given
these committees will be making recom= .-permission 'to -revise and extend his
mendations as to how the Congress might remarks.)
improve and strengthen its oversight of ` Mr. GIAIMO. IyMr.. Chairman, I should
September deadline mentioned in the
amendment of the gentleman. is not real-
istic. It gives very little time. - - -
I I recognize the fact that the other body
has selected that date. However, I would
say that--the other body, has. ah;eady
passed its legislation. It has. a head start
of some -weeks on this body and, quite
frankly, it is our opinion and -that of'
the cosponsors.of this legislation that the
deadline date which the other body has
incorporated -into this legislation will not
be sufficient to do .a proper job, and my
guess will be that they will be extend-
ing theirs..
I do not think It. is unreasonable' to-
limit the duration of this. select. commit-
-tee until' January 31, 1976,. and I ask
that the amendment be voted down. -
The CHAIRMAN. The, question. is 'on
the amendment - offered- ' by the .gentle- :
. man from Illinois (Mr. ANDERSON).
The amendment was rejected. _
Mrs. FENWICK. Mr. Chairman; I move
to strike the last word:
(Mrs. FENWICK asked and was given
permission to . revise and extend. her
remarks.)
-
Mrs. FENWICK. I should like to ap-.
peal, Mr. Chairman, to the Members -of
this House, and most particularly to my .
friends on the other side of. the aisle. I
think we all know that patriotism rath-
er than partisanship is what must guide.
us if we are to respond to what the peo-
ple told us to do in the last.' election.
There is more to it. I think an investiga-
tory body has to not only do justice but
be seen to do justice., I think that we
should rise. to it. I hope very much, since
the section does not describe the mem-.
bership of the committee, but leaves it
entirely to the generosity and the spirit
of bipartisanship of the Speaker and of.
the leadership and of the great majority
of. Democrats in this House, that per-
haps it could be at least 6-to-4, if not
5-to-5. - -
1 know that my friends on the. other.
side- of the aisle know that I speak in no
partisan spirit, but I think it.would con-
vince the people of this Nation that we
can rise above party, that we are ear-
nestly seeking the truth, that we are not
trying to go on witch hunts or hurt peo-. -
ple, but that we are trying to protect the
integrity of our institutions and the ur-
gent and necessary fact that the institu-
tions of government cannot be used for
personal or' political reasons. All this
needs to be driven home, and I hope that
the composition of the-committee will ef-
fect it.
I thank the Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk- will read.
The Clerk read as follows: ?
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 -11882 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD -HOUSE February 19,4975;
SEC. 8. Theq t ea 0.00/0 ?/ CIAS
RE)
P83B00823 70oo4toa?1-3
expire three months after the ing oft ere- m ni s aEk San on. Mr. Chappell with Mr. Moorhead of Call-
Mitchell, Md. Randall J. William
port with the House of Representatives. Mitchel T QV P.-I crs -, , Yornia_ , .
CHAT Ih
Th
e
~.:r ri... tere are no ivloffett. Regina Stark Mr. Riegle *Ith Mr. Bob Wilson.
further amendments, under the rule, the Mollohan Reuss Steelman Mr. Rose wit Mr. Traxler.
Committee rises. Moorhead, Pa. Richmond Stokes ' Mr. Horton with-Mr. Mills.
Accordingly the Committee rose; and Morgan' Rinaldo Studds Mr. Downing with Mr. Jarman..
Mosher Rjsenhoover Sullivan
the Speaker having resumed the chair, Mr. Fulton with Mr. Goldwater,.
Moss Rodino Symington Mr. Jefiords with; Mr: Stratton ;
-Mr. FLYNT, Chairman of the Committee Mottl Roe Thompson
of the Whole House on the- State of the - Murphy, Ill-. Rogers Thornton- Mr.. Steed with Mr..Talcott.
-..Union, reported that that. Committee, lIurphy,N.Y. Roncalio Treen The result of'the vote was announced
having had under consideration the res- Natcher Murtha: - . ' Rosenthal Udall as above recorded:
olution (H. Res. 138) establishing a Neal . Rostenkowski Ullman A motion to reconsider was-laid on
Select Committee on Intelligence, pill-- Nedzi Roush Vander Veen the table
suant to House Resolution 174, he re- ' Nix Roybai - Vanik -
Nowak Runnels Vigorito
ported the resolution back to the House Oberstar - Ruppe Wampler -
with sundry amendments adopted by the Obey . Russo _ Waxman
Committee of the Whole.. O'Brien Ryan Weaver
O'Hara St Germain Whalen
The SPEAKER, Under the rule, the O'Neill. ' - Sarasin Wilson.
previous question is ordered. Ottinger. Sarbanes. Charles H.,
Is a separate vote demanded on any Patman ? Scheuer ilson.
Patterson Calii.SChroeder Wilson
GENERAL. LEAVE"
Mr. MURPHY of Illinois.. Mr. Speaker,
I'ask unanimous consent that-all Mem-
bers may-have: 5. legislative days in
which to revise and extend their re-
amendment? If not, the Chair will put Pattison, N.Y. Seiberling Charles, Tax, , marks on the resolution just agreed to.
them en gros. Pepper Sharp Wirth - . The SPEAKER: Is there objection to
The amendments were agreed to. Perkins Shipley Wolff
Peyser Shriver Wright the request of the gentleman from IIIi-
The SPEAKER. The question is on the Pickle' Simon Yates -nols?
resolution. Pike - Sisk Yatron There was no-objection
Mr. BAUMAN. Mr. Speaker, on that Pressler Slack Young, Alaska -
Preyer. Smitit, Iowa Young; Ga.
I demand the yeas and nays. -
'
The yeas and nays were ordered.
The vote was taken by electronic de-
vice, and there were-yeas 288, nays 120,
not voting 26, as follows.
[Roll No. 181
YEAS--286
Abzug de is Garza
Adams Delaney
Addabbo Dellums
Alexander Dent
Anibro Derwinski
Anderson, Dingell
Calif. Dodd
Anderson, Ill. Downey
Andrews, N.C., . Drlnan
Andrews, du Pont
N. DAk. - Early
Annunzio - Eckhardt
Hechier, W. Va.
Heckler,.Mass.
Hefner
Heinz .
Helstoski
Hendereon
Hightower
Hillis
Holland
Holtzman
Howard
Howe
Armstrong Edgar Hughes -
Ashley Edwards, Calif. Hungate.
Aspin Emery Ichord
Badillo English Jacobs.
Baldus
Baucus
Beard, R.I.
Bedell
Bell
Bennett
Biaggi -
Erlenborn
Each
Evans, Colo.
Evans, Ind.
Evins, Tenn.
Fascell
Fenwick
Biester Findley
Bingham Fish
Blanchard Fisher
Blouin ?' Fithian
Boggs Flood
Boland Florio
Boiling Flowers
Booker Flynt
Johnson, Calif.
Johnson. Colo.
Jones, Ala.
Jones, N.C.
Jones, Okla.
Jones, Tenn.
Jordan
Karth
Kasten -
Kastenmeier
Kazen
Keys
Koch
Krebs
.Lehman
Bowen Foley Litton- -
Brademas Ford, Mich. Lloyd, Tenn.
Breaux Ford, Tenn. Long, La.
Breckinridge Fraser Long, Md.
Brodhead Frenzel Lujan.
Brooks Frey McClory'
Broomfield Fuqus McCloskey
Brown, Calif. Gaydos McCormack
Brown, Ohio Glaimo McDade
Broyhill Gibbons McFall
Burke, Calif. Gilman McHugh
Burke, Mass.. ' Gonzalez McKay
Burlison, Mo. Gradison McKinney
Burton, John L.Grassley Macdonald
Burton, Phillip Green. Madden
Carney Gude - Madigan
Carr - Haley Maguire
Chisholm Hall Mahon
Clay
Cohen'
Collins, Ill.
Conte
Conyers
Gorman
Cotter
Daniels,
Dominick V.
Danielson
Davis
Hamilton Mann .
Hanley Matsunaga
Hannaford Mazzola
Harkin Meeds
Harrington Alelcher-
Harris Metcalfe
Hastings- Meyner
Hawkins Mezvinsky .
Hayes, Tnd. Mikva
Hays, Ohio Miller, Calif.
Hebert Mineta
Price
Solarz Zablocki
Pritchard
Spellman . ? -.-` Zeferetti
NAYS-120
Abdnor
Forsythe
- Nichols
Archer
Fountain ,
Nolan
Ashbrook,
Gina
. Passman
AuCoin..
Goodling
Patten
Bafalis
Guyer
Poage
Bauman:' -' -
Hcigedorn
Quillen
Beard,Tenn:
Hammer-
Rhodes
Beviil..
rchmidt ,
Roberts
Brinkley
Hansen
' Robinson
Brown, Mich..
Harsha
Buchanan
Hicks
Santini
Burgener.
Hinshaw
Satterfield
Burke, Fla.
- Holt
Schneebeli
Burleson, Tex.
Hubbard
Sebelius
Butler
Hutchinson
Shuster
Byron
Jenrette-
Sikes
Carter
Johnson, Pa.
Skubitz
Casey
Kelly
Smith, Nebr.
Cederberg .;
Kemp
-' Snyder
Clancy .
Ketchum ..
Spence
Clausen, -'
Kindness
Steiger, Ar'.z.
Don H.
Krueger
Steiger, Wis.
Cleveland
LaFalce
Stephens
Cochran
Lagomarsino
Stuckey
Collins, Tex.
Landrum
Symms
Conable -
Latta
Taylor, N.C. ?
Conlan
Lent
Teague
Cornell
Levitas
Thone
Coughlin
Lloyd, Calif.
- Van Deerlin
Crane
Lott
VanderJagt
D'Amours
McCollister .
, Waggonner
Daniel, Dan.
McDonald -
Walsh
Daniel, Robert
McEwen
. White
W.. Jr.
Martin
. Whitehurst
Derrick
Mathis
Whitten
Devine
Milford'
Wiggins
Dickinson.
Miller, Ohio
- Winn
Duncan, Oreg..
Montgomery
Wydler
Duncan, Tenn.- Moore
Wylie
Edwards, Ala.
Myers, Ind.
Young, Fla.
Eshleman
Myers, Pa.
.- Young, Tex..
NOT VOTING-28
Barrett'
Horton -
Riegle
Bergland
Hyde
Rose
Chappell
Jarman
Schulze
Clawson, Del
Jeffords
Steed
Diggs
Leggett -
Stratton
Downing
Michel
Talcott
Eilberg
Mills
Taylor, Mo.
Fulton
Moorhead,
Trailer
Goldwater
Calif.
`Wllson,Bob
So the resolution was agreed to. passage, could 'be - even' more - harmful
The Clerk announced the following than no law at. all in some communities.
pairs: - ? - Fortunately we still -have the time to.
On this vote: - ? - make the necessary corrections, which
Mr. Diggs for, with Mr. Schulze against. the bill I 1 troduce today would accOm-
Mr. Eilberg for, with Mr. Del Clawson push: '
against.
Unless we do-snake-these adjustments
Missouri ernett ainst. for, with Mr. Taylor In the aet'we can expect to see many of
our areas suffer unnecessarily through
Until further notice: declining property values, an inability to
.APPOINTMENT AS- MEMBERS OF
7-SELECT COMMIT'TEE :- ON' INTEL-
LIGENCE -
The SPEAKER. - Pursuant to- House
Resolution 138,--the'Chair appoints the
_following Members' to the Select Com-
mittee on Intelligence: Mr. Nsnzx; chair-
man; Mr. GiAmso;. Mr. EDWARDS of Call-
fornia; Mr. JAMES V. STANTON;-Mr: HAR-
RINGTON; Mr. DELLUTIS; Mr:-MImPFIY of
Illinois; Mr. MCCLORY;- Mr. TREEN;. and.
FLOOD INSURANCE-
(Mr. CASEY asked and was given per-
.mission to address the Hoe for 1 min-
ute and' to revise algid extend. -his
Mr. CASEY. Mr_ Speaker, today 'I am
introducing a bill. that. I believe will be
of interest to each and every colleague in .
the House, since. it .concerns the Flood
Disaster Protection Act of 1973. - ?
I know that the all fully recognize the
need for flood insurance and the. protec,
tion that it affords our constituents in
the event of disastrous flooding. There is
an urgent necessity for. its continued
-Availability and,. at the subsidized rates
provided illider;'Public Law 93-234.
The law has my full support in its pur-
pose and I would like to compliment the
Flood Insuralice Adnministration for the
conscientious, work it has done .t0 imple-
ment the law.' ?
However, there are some provisions of
the law which can have disastrous effects
in themselves if implemented as sched-
uled on Julyc 1, 1975. These effects, which
I know were not foreseen by,those of us
who ardently supported the law at its
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