MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP86B00269R000600030013-8
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 4
• Document Creation Date: December 14, 2016
• Document Release Date: November 20, 2002
• Sequence Number: 13
• Publication Date: October 22, 1974
• Content Type: MEMO

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DCI/IC 74-2355
22 October 1974
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
PARTICIPANTS: William E. Colby, Director of Central Intelligence
William J. Barnds, Murphy Commission
DATE: October 21, 1974
IC Staff
1. Mr. Colby and Mr. Barnds met for approximately
40 minutes and discussed four general topics (itemized below)
introduced by Mr. Barnds. The atmosphere was cordial and
relaxed. Mr. Barnds did not take notes.
2. Guidance and Feedback: Mr. Barnds asked whether
Mr. Colby fe t'i policymakers were sufficiently responsive in pro-
viding guidance and reactions. Mr. Colby remarked. that in the
real world policymakers are extremely busy and do not have time
to sit down and produce report cards for the intelligence community.
He said that the consumer is used to a high standard of quality
and doesn't feel the need to comment on what is regarded as a
satisfactory norm. He pointed out that Secretary Kissinger called
for intelligence briefings at all major policy meetings. On the
subject of formal guidance, the Director outlined the KIQ/KEP process
and said that the main effort is to get policymakers to sign off on
the KIQs so that they will think about the issues and so that the
DCI can establish a baseline for how well the intelligence community
is responding to these questions. The Director also discussed the
NSCIC and his hope that this mechanism will be increasingly active.
He noted that consumer influence is likely to come largely from
informal channels, particularly through himself and the NIO
mechanism. Mr. Colby said he believes that cross-channel communication
is improving as the essentially vertical hierarchies of the intelligence
community learn to talk to one another. He pointed out that the NIO
system is not a command channel. It reflects the DCI's effort to
tell program managers what is important not how to manage their
separate organizations.
3. Economic Intelligence: Mr. Barnds outlined the problems
of establishing etf boundaries of what should be collected in this
field, who should analyze it, and how non-USIB agencies tap into the
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system. Mr. Colby pointed out the difficulties confronted by
intelligence organizations which have information that would be
valuable to US business and the national economy, but which cannot
favor one US business over another. He remarked that this is a
dilemma that he has yet to solve. Mr. Colby explained that
non-USIB agencies can task the intelligence community directly or
through the Requirements Advisory Board. He said that a major
problem is that every agency has its own economic shop and that
there is no central point to bring the research and analysis
together. He said that the NIO for economics is working on this
issue.
4. Organization of the CIA for Clandestine Activities:
Mr. Barnds said that clandestine activity is based on they assumption
that secrecy can be maintained, which may no longer be a safe
assumption, particularly with the divergence of views--both public
and in government--on US foreign policy activites. He pointed out
that clandestine activity, particularly covert action, is going
to be a highly controversial matter for some time and that the
Commission will be paying particular attention lx this issue. He
indicated that he understood the impracticability of attempting
to set up two competing DDOs that would focus respectively on
clandestine intelligence gathering,and on covert action. He asked
whether it might not be practical, however, to separate certain
deep cover covert action efforts.
Mr. Colby responded by pointing out that the trend in
the Agency is in the opposite direction, and that the experience
of the Bay of Pigs has taught us that it is important to have senior
analytical officers review proposed covert action plans before they
are submitted to the Forty Committee. He said that efforts to
separate portions of the DDO have proved unworkable in the past and
moreover would sacrifice the valuable interrelationship that officers
in the field must have if operations are to succeed at all. Mr. Colby
also noted that cover arrangements remain a problem, but are really
more a problem in the US than overseas where foreigners don't much
care since they view all US officials as reporters for the USG.
The Director outlined the normal working of an overseas station
and emphasized that it would not be possible for a station to separate
its functions into categories such as liaison or recruitment. All
officers should be able to do all tasks, and flaps do not result
when their work is done well. He said that professionalism is
increasing and that this is the best safeguard the community has
for its intelligence operations. The Director also discussed attempts
to misuse the Agency and his belief that any improper requests would
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meet with complete employee rejection, which he applauded. He
brought up his Sources and Methods legislative package and
explained the need for such a program, particularly following the
Agee and Marchetti cases. Mr. Colby reviewed the types of briefing
he provides for Congress and said that while he does not volunteer
the names of sources, he would give any information requested by
the Agency oversight committees.
5. Management Responsibilities: Mr. Barnds and Mr. Colby
briefly discussed the DCI's budget review of other agencies'
intelligence programs. Mr. Colby said he could identify questions
and make recommendations on budget questions, but could not force
other agencies to follow his guidance. Mr. Barnds asked what areas
of the community seem to be weakest, and Mr. Colby responded that
inequalities in personnel grade levels have adversely affected some
agencies.
Coordination Staff/Secretariat
DCI/IC/CS/S/
Distribution:
1 - PCI
1 - DDCI
1 - ER
1 - DDO
1-IC I
1-
1 - CS chron
Orig - CS subj
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