PRESIDENT JOSE NAPOLEON DUARTE

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP88-01070R000301720002-5
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 13
• Document Creation Date: December 22, 2016
• Document Release Date: January 21, 2010
• Sequence Number: 2
• Publication Date: May 19, 1985
• Content Type: OPEN SOURCE

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RADIO TV REPORTS, INC.
4701 WILLARD AVENUE, CHEVY CHASE, MARYLAND 20815 [phone]
PROGRAM McLaughlin One-on-One STATION WRC-TV
May 19, 1985 11:00 A.M.
Washington, D.C.
SUBJECT President Jose Napoleon Duarte
JOHN MCLAUGHLIN: This man is the first elected civilian
President of El Salvador in 50 years. Can he maintain his
nation's fragile democracy against left-wing guerrillas and
right-wing death squads?
Born San Salvador, 59 years of age. Wife, Inez. Four
daughters, two sons. Roman Catholic. University of Notre Dame,
B.S. engineering. National University of El Salvador, lecturer,
one year. Christian Democratic Party, a founder in 1960 and
Secretary-General for 13 years. Presidential candidate 1972,
denied his victory by the military, arrested, tortured, exiled.
Returned 1979. Businessman, Caracas, during seven years of
exile. President of El Salvador, elected May 1984, 54 percent of
the vote. National Assembly Election, March '85. His Christian
Democratic party won 54 percent of the vote, 33 seats out of 60,
demolishing the right wing. As Presidet, last October he met
with the guerrillas trying to overthrow him, notably, rebel
leader Guillermo Ungo in La Palma, unarmed, for peace dialogue.
On May 16th met privately with President Reagan to review the El
Salvador situation.
Jose Napoleon Duarte, President of El Salvador, it's
one-on-one.
MCLAUGHLIN: One of the things that amazes me about you,
Mr. President, is your friendship with Guillermo Ungo and Reuben
Zamora. Guillermo Ungo ran with you as vice presidential running
mate when you ran for President in 1972. Correct?
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MCLAUGHLIN: Where is he today?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, he's -- I think he's in Panama.
And he's traveling all around the world.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, he's, I would call it, a
diplomatic delegate for the FMLN.
MCLAUGHLIN: He is your enemy.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Yes.
MCLAUGHLIN: He's the head of the guerrillas.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, let me put it this way. He was
a democrat. He was fighting along with me in favor of democracy.
Then all the problems of the country frustrated him. He became
then frustrated of democracy and he thought that the only
solution was the violent revolution. So he went out to join the
revolutionary groups. And there was a lot of people at that time
that thought the same way.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think that he's been sincere. Now
he's too much compromised.
MCLAUGHLIN: And you met with him in La Palma and you
dialogued with him.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Yes, I did. I was with him in La
MCLAUGHLIN: And you were with Reumen Zamora. And
Reuben Zamora helped found your Christian Democratic Party.
Right?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Yes. He was a member of the Chris-
tian Democratic Party once. But...
MCLAUGHLIN: Now these men are your enemies. How do you
explain that?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, this is what happened, even in
the families, when they have difference in ideologies and point
of view.
MCLAUGHLIN: They may be your enemies, but this week you
met with a friend, and your friend is Ronald Reagan. He
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describes you publicly as a close friend. You are a close friend
of his, are you not?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, I think that there's been a
mutual closeness between President Reagan and myself. I think
that President Reagan took the responsibility to try to confront
the problems of Central America, and he saw me there walking.
And so he's given me...
MCLAUGHLIN: He's given you aid?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: ...understanding, political support,
and a economic and a military support.
MCLAUGHLIN: He's given you $128 million in military aid
and $313 million in economic aid, about $440 million. Did you
get any more aid from him when you visited with him yesterday?
Did you ask for more aid?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: The only thing I said is that we need
more space and aid to continue on working toward democracy in our
country. So I said, "Please, President, keep on helping us,
because that will give us space and time to have the initiative
on all the fronts and win the war. And not only win the war, but
also win the peace, which is more important."
MCLAUGHLIN: Did he tell you he'd give you more? Did he
put any dollar figure on it?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No. He only said tht he will
continue helping us.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you use any of that economic aid for
military purposes?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No. No, we have separated both. The
military aid is to strengthen the army. I want a very strong
army. And this is the difference not for dictatorship, but for
democracy.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you actually see that aid in dollars?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, we don't. We get the armament,
we get the equipment, we get the helicopters. We don't handle
any money.
MCLAUGHLIN: With regard to the war and the prosecution
of the war, has the tide turned for good, do you think, in your
favor?
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Just this morning I mentioned to a newspaperman that we have
found a [unintelligible] that was making signals up very deep in
the land of our country, up to Morozon (?). And we went up
there, captured it. Now we're moving it to a port and see what
[unintelligible] it is [unintelligible].
MCLAUGHLIN: You really have a certain amount to boast
about because your economy, remarkably enough, despite the civil
war, has improved for the first time in a long time. The GNP
growth rate went up last year. Correct?
percent.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: That is correct. We went up to three
MCLAUGHLIN: And your army has become more profession-
PRESIDENT DUARTE: And the army has been more profes-
sionalized. We're reducing death squads. We're reducing the
abuses of authority. Were are getting more control on the
country. We are -- this is a very remarkable thing that we have
done. We have had 100 strikes from labor groups, and we have not
one single action of repression.
MCLAUGHLIN: What about private capital, influx of
private capital?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: We are also helping the private
enterprise. We have given all the rules of the game. Just one
day before I left, I gave all the rules for the coffee people,
and they're happy about it.
MCLAUGHLIN: You mean the rules of engagement?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, no, the rules of the game, how
they're going to play the economy in the country, the private
enterprise, and how we could help them on achieving the goals of
reactivation of...
MCLAUGHLIN: The guerrillas are still, of course, very
active and they have abducted 15 of your mayors, they have
kidnapped. Correct?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: They also have killed some of them.
MCLAUGHLIN: And they have killed some of them.
Who is supplying the guerrillas?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: There is no question that they come
from Nicaragua, Cuba and the Soviet Union.
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MCLAUGHLIN: Do you have proof of that?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Oh, sure. We have thousands and
thousands of proofs.
MCLAUGHLIN: Say, from Nicaragua. Do you have proof?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: We have documents. We have all kinds
of documents. We have just captured a guerrilla leader by the
name of Nida Rios (?), and she had thousands of papers.
MCLAUGHLIN: That's not Napoleon Romero?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, that's not Napoleon Romero.
That's Nida Rios. That's a woman who was a commander. And she
was full of documents who contain all the information.
MCLAUGHLIN: What percentage of the armaments that go to
the guerrillas come from Nicaragua?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, this is Romeros Castillano (?)
who said that 70 percent.
MCLAUGHLIN: Now, he's a defector from the guerrillas.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He is a defector from the guerrillas.
MCLAUGHLIN: He was a commander.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He was a commander. He was a
political commander of the central front.
MCLAUGHLIN: What's he saying?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He's saying that 70 percent of the
armament come from Nicaragua.
MCLAUGHLIN: Well, there are some members in the
Congress who don't agree with that. For example, they quote a
former CIA man by the name of McMichael, David C. McMichael, who
was monitoring the flow of weaponry from Nicaragua to El Sal-
vador. And he said the contention of this Administration that
there is a flow over the past three years is not true. And he
became disgusted and he went to Managua. And now he's picking
cotton in Nicaragua.
How do you explain that?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, maybe his ideology was [un-
intelligible] before he went to Nicaragua.
MCLAUGHLIN: You think it's a question of his being a
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PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, why is he doing that? But that
I wouldn't like to discuss. I think that any person has the
right to take his own...
MCLAUGHLIN: I want to talk to you about the Nicaraguans
a little bit more, but I have a question for you. Do you think
that the CIA has penetrated the Sandinista junta?
MCLAUGHLIN: Last fall, in an interview with Playboy
magazine, you said that you thought they had.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, I had never said that. They
might interpret it that I did. But I try never to say anything
that I don't know, and I don't really know anything on the
infiltration or control, or anything, of the CIA in the Sandinis-
ta government.
MCLAUGHLIN: When we come back I want to talk to you
about the trade embargo that Presidsent Reagan has imposed upon
the Nicaraguans.
MCLAUGHLIN: The President of the United States intro-
duced a trade embargo against Nicaragua. Do you approve of that
embargo?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, let me put it this way. I
cannot express opinions on the United States policies. But there
is no question that I feel that the attitude of the United States
is not only, but the response of the attitude of Nicaragua. And
you heard what he said, what President Ortega said. He said, "I
will not talk to the dogs. I will talk to the owner of the
dogs." This is the language of the [unintelligible] and the
attitude that Nicaragua is having not only with the United
States, but with everybody.
MCLAUGHLIN: The press spokesman for the President told
reporters that you support the trade embargo.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, I support all the measures that
will move in the direction of peace in the country.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think a trade embargo will work?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think that they are presenting
these actions to try to obtain the Nicaraguan government to move
in the direction of democracy.
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MCLAUGHLIN: You think a trade embargo is a good idea.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think that if you analyze it from
the political international point of view, I think that the
problem is that the trade embargo will work on the democratic-
influenced countries, but not on the Communist-influenced
countries. And I think that this is the reason why immediately
after the trade embargo started, Mr. Ortega went to Russia.
MCLAUGHLIN: Well, if the trade embargo is working,
which apparently it is, as you say, why don't you join the
embargo?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, we don't have to, because
Nicaragua owes us $200 million.
MCLAUGHLIN: They owe you 200 million?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Yes, sir.
MCLAUGHLIN: But you still trade with them.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, we have to collect our money.
MCLAUGHLIN: Oh, I see.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: It's not a matter of...
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you approve of Ronald Reagan's peace
proposal of April?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Oh, definitely. I propose all the
peace actions that will try to look for Central America, and Mr.
Reagan has proposed a humanitarian action and a peace proposal.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you favor aid, military aid by the U.S.
Government to the Contras who are fighting the Sandinistas?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Here, I have two points of view. One
is I cannot commit myself on supporting guerrilla groups in
another country. Because if I do that, then I will be accepting
the Nicaraguans who [unintelligible] guerrillas in El Salvador.
But I do understand that we need a barrier to stop the flow of
arms from Nicaragua to El Salvador. And the Contras have been
like, with the ships that they have in the gulf and the radars
and all that makes a barrier. And that barrier is in favor of
our country.
MCLAUGHLIN: Well, if on the one hand you support his
peace proposal, his peace initiative of April, in which he said
that at the end of 60 days, if there is no movement, we will then
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give military aid to the Contras, and now you say you can't
support military aid to the Contras...
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, wait a minute. You have to
distinguish my proposition. I say I cannot support guerrillas in
another country. But the support of the Contras has been a
barrier to stop flow of arms from Nicaragua to El Salvador. That
I support because that helps my country.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think the Contras can win?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, I don't think that any guerril-
la could win against any country unless there is a democratic
action inside.
up?
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think that the Sandinistas will give
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, I think that they will keep on
fighting. But I think that the only solution in Nicaragua is
that inside, democratic forces like the church, like the private
enterprise, like the unions and all that, they should get
together and support so that the democratic actions inside will
not surrender to the Communists. And that is the difference of
concept that I have.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think the United States -- there's
another way, too, and that's the military solution. Do you think
the United States should invade Nicaragua?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No, I don't think so. I don't think
they will. And if you analyze the position of Mr. Reagan, you
will see that he's not thinking of invading. He's trying to stop
the cancer to spread around.
MCLAUGHLIN: Now, in your own country, do you find that
the guerrillas who are fighting you, who are being fed by
Nicaragua and Russia and Cuba, as you say, are they coming over
now to join you? Are you getting -- is there some leakage in
your direction?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Oh, yes. Yes. We had more than 500
people who had surrendered and that they have left the guerrillas
and come into the government.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you also find that, in addition to their
coming over, has to death squad activity ceased or...
PRESIDENT DUARTE: They have reduced considerable.
MCLAUGHLIN: When you took office 500 people were being
killed a month.
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PRESIDENT DUARTE: And not only that, there were a whole
organization behind these death squads. And now we have solved
that and we are reducing the actions. And I have a very good
criteria, and that's the every-month report to the Red Cross, the
International Red Cross.
MCLAUGHLIN: How many being killed a month?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, on this -- let's call them this
unknown causes, I had last month four cases.
MCLAUGHLIN: The number we see in the reports here is 30
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, this is the overall...
MCLAUGHLIN: What percentage of those are due to
left-wing activity?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I would say 70 percent.
MCLAUGHLIN: Seventy percent, about two-thirds, a little
more than two-thirds.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think that because of the abduction
of the mayors and the terrorist activities by the guerrillas, the
left-wing guerrillas against the civilians, that there will be a
resurgence of right-wing death squad activity in retaliation?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: No. I think that this is the action
of the left against the democratic policies. This is a fight in
a political war and against the democratic action of the elec-
tions. The guerrillas are acting against the mayors and they're
kidnapping them and killing them. But this is a confrontation
between the government and the guerrillas. The death squads have
nothing to do with that.
MCLAUGHLIN: In Argentina there's a civilian president,
as you know, and he has reopened many, many cases where there was
violence against civilians, and torture and abuse and killing.
Forty thousand civilians have been killed in El Salvador in the
last, what, five years?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Five years. Yes.
MCLAUGHLIN: Are you going to reopen any of those cases,
as they're doing in Argentina?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: We have. I just presented the
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National Assembly with a law so that we can install an institute
for investigation and foreign laboratories -- forensic laborato-
ries and investigation laboratories, so that we can get the
technical know-how how to start investigating.
MCLAUGHLIN: And you're trying to stabilize your
criminal justice system.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: And also I have presented a law in
which we have made a commission to study all the laws of the
country, so that we can control that.
MCLAUGHLIN: I have one quick question for you before we
go to the next segment, and that is this: In the United States,
Mr. President, there are 500,000 Salvadorans. The State Depart-
ment says we don't want them. They are not here seeking asylum
from danger, they are not here trying to escape persecution.
They are, quote-unquote, economic migrants, half a million.
Do you want them back?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, I'll be delighted if you give
me permission to ask the people in the United States to let them
stay in the United States. Because this is [unintelligible] El
Salvadoran people who have come to this country to try to make a
living, and they are helping their own people in their own
country. So I think it's part of the aid that we're getting in
order to reestablish the economy in our country.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think that the State Department
should relax its policies towards these Salvadorans?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think so. This is my belief.
MCLAUGHLIN: When we come back I want to talk to you a
little bit more about the conditions in El Salvador.
MCLAUGHLIN: You met with the guerrillas twice last year
and they want to meet with you again in June in private, and then
in public. Are you going to meet with them?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: My proposition is that we should work
on conversations to make sure that we will obtain goals of
humanizing the conflict. And if that is so, then I'm ready to
meet with them.
MCLAUGHLIN: Now, have you made it easy for the guerril-
las to put down their arms and join the...
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PRESIDENT DUARTE: I've been trying everything I can.
MCLAUGHLIN: You provide amnesty?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I have provided all kinds of actions.
They have surrendered for hundreds, and I gave them all the help
I can.
MCLAUGHLIN: What sticks in the throat, the bone that
sticks in their throat is they want to have power before elec-
tions, and you're saying no: If you want to have political
power, you must do what I do, and that's stand for election.
Is that the essence of it?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: That's democracy.
MCLAUGHLIN: And is that the essence of the problem?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: That's the essence of the problem.
They have seen the method of violence to seize power. And this
is the same thing that the extreme right is trying to do: use
death squads to seize power. And both are wrong.
I am asking the people to decide for themself their own
destiny. And for that, we have to respect the democratic rules.
MCLAUGHLIN: You are willing to talk to your enemies,
the guerrillas, even though they were once your friends, like
Zamora and Ungo. But the Sandinistas will not talk to the
Contras.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Because they're not democrats.
MCLAUGHLIN: In addition to that, the Contras, as one
told me, the leader of the Contras sitting in the chair you are
in, Mr. President, he said to me, "We do not want power-sharing.
We want a restoration of democratic freedoms."
Despite the fact they don't want power-sharing, as your
guerrillas do, the Sandinistas will still not talk to them. How
do you explain that?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, obviously, this is the same
thing that Castro did in Cuba. This is the Communist totalita-
rian method. The moment they seize power, they don't give it
away. And they don't want to talk, they don't want to discuss.
They only want to...
MCLAUGHLIN: Why?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Because they're totalitarians. And
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in a democratic regime, a democratic regime is based on partici-
pation. It's based on having everybody a capacity and the right
to speak and to try to express his own thinkings. And this is
what I'm trying to do.
power?
MCLAUGHLIN: Is it essentially an attitude towards
PRESIDENT DUARTE: It is essentially, for the totalita-
rians, an attitude toward power. And it is essential for
democracy the participation of all.
MCLAUGHLIN: Two quick questions. Has Orgeta permanent-
ly scarred himself by his tour of Eastern Europe? Has he scarred
himself, disfigured himself as far as the United States Congress
is concerned?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: Well, I think that what he's doing is
showing what he really is. And he's a Communist.
MCLAUGHLIN: And a big tactical mistake.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think it's a big tactical mistake.
MCLAUGHLIN: And secondly, the Contadora process. Clear
up something for me. Are you in favor of the process involving
Colombia, Venezuela, Mexico and Panama?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I am in favor of the 21 points. Not
in favor of who's there, but in favor of the process of the 21
points, which I believe are human programs for all.
MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think Ronald Reagan and the State
Department has enough respect for the Contadora process, or
should they treat it with more respect?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think that Mr. Reagan is in favor
of the Contadora. He told me that yesterday. And I discussed
with him that, and I said that the only thing that worries me is
that this Contadora process meets the will of the four or the
five Central American countries. And if one of them don't have
the will to comply with and to obey the rules...
MCLAUGHLIN: You said that.
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I said that.
MCLAUGHLIN: Which one does not have the will?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: I think Nicaragua doesn't have the
will. And this is the reason why I am fighting inside Central
America to strengthen this will.
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MCLAUGHLIN: When we come back I'm going to ask you the
mega-question.
* *
MCLAUGHLIN: We have 20 seconds.
What does Fidel Castro stand for in your mind?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He's a Communist and he's supporting
Nicaragua and supporting the guerrillas in El Salvador.
MCLAUGHLIN: What does Pinochet stand for in Chile?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He is an extreme rightist dictator-
ship.
MCLAUGHLIN: What does Duarte stand for?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He stands for liberty.
MCLAUGHLIN: Liberty throughout. Does he stand for free
enterprise?
PRESIDENT DUARTE: He stands for free enterprise. He
stands for the people. He stands for democracy. He stands for
peace.
MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you very much for being my guest on
One-on-One.
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