CONGRESSIONAL RECORD - HOUSE

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP78-03721A000100050011-2
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 17
• Document Creation Date: December 12, 2016
• Document Release Date: February 12, 2002
• Sequence Number: 11
• Content Type: MISC

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TAB
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7111r
'nate restored4-4,40.0000;'reqUeetad
ty the Navy to permit the trUteter ot )Ivy
:Judie ,receletrig facUlties tivAtiSheltenlialft4
to Sugar -Protei'lVe rk:Tb.. tem*
-- pointed ot this due to eeerthtu
high noise )(Tali it the ?ituurig
Asti31i1300,tha ragouts 'fasiSties akeblike
Iithani Milt he Meted to Aintither
Since the Sena! Orono site hi, Welly suited
for this perpotia adtelitage ten Se taken of
?:-tne existing invanwnt pt,thii_navy at this
Iltelient,1091StifIL:'e train
nil posit1011:alad'aicepted-the henete amend-
"
Classified naval Mite lZ
The Senate 'authorised four construction
projects for naval installations at Puerto
Nio0 In the amount of $8,4e7.000. These
_items had previously been deleted by the
House. The House conferees insisted that
these projects could be properly deferred un-
til the fiscal year 1903 program. The Senate
corifereea receded from their position and
accepted the House deletion.
The Senate deleted two projects for Rota.
Spain. and a communication facility at an-
other location in the total amount of 510.-
3/11.000 These items had previously been
approved by the House. The Senate con-
ferees pointed out that these projects could
aelely be deferred until the fiscal year 1906
program. The House conferees receded from
their position and accepted the Senate dele-
tions.
As a consequence of the foregoing changes,
Hi e authorization to the Secretary of the
Navy for the development of classified naval
installaUons way reduced from $71,632,000.
to a new figure of $63,095.000.
Randolph Air Force Base, San Antonio, Tex.
The Senate authorized $3,044.000 for eon-
strut:non and related improvements at this
location. The House had previously author-
ized only $1,476,000. The major difference In
the House and Senate action was the refusal
of the Howie to provide $2,087.000 required
for alterations to the headquarter, building
at Randolph to house ink Mr Force person-
nel management facilities at that location.
'The Senate conferees were of the opinion
?that the increased management efficiency
and economies that would result from the
centralization of personnel management fa-
cilities at Randolph would more than justify
the conetruction cost involved in this re-
location. The House conferees. therefore,
receded from their position and aceepted the
Senate ounendment.
'Laredo Air Force Base, Laredo, Tex,
? The Howse had provided authorization In
the amount of 53.134,000 to be accomplished
'at
an air training command facility to be
selected by the Department of Defense. The
House Committee on Armed Services in testi-
mony provided it by witnesses of the De-
pinninent of the Air Force was of the opinion
thee this construction would be effected at
Laredo Air Force Base. This opinion was
subsequently confirmed by cor'respondence
received from the Department. Subsequent-
ly, the Senate In acting on this authorization
request, deleted the item In Its entirety.
The House conferees pointed out that a
serious deficit in the number of pilots in the
Air Force will exist throughout the foresee-
able future unless the production of new
-pilots is Increased. The House conferees also
pointed out that Laredo Air Force Base Is
ideally suited for this 'purpose. However.
construction is required to insure appro-
priate training facilities for the pilot train-
Mg which should occur at this base.
The Senate conferees were of the opinion
tint this entire project could be deterred
another year Atter eoneelerable olacusaion,
the sonfertr, pao,.lde the Arta ha-
crernent ot ,,tith:lzatton tor
No 174----l3
am.000
Thisiiiithorleatinnie the *Unite*: not.
Roo of, a lighting deftarCy on tins runway Mr
- -
approach to the Ina. ? ? ' - 'eau otz
the remaining Mae dans for Laredo Air r
Porta Rao which were deferred should be ifts'
raltdirlitOta,b7 'OSP DOPIrtrusta tor ripooti-
adoration by th41 Houlsr.111) connectlaWidtli
the Elspartassat% flacel. year lOSS cauldroa,
OltitilleabortiatiOn Sigtrieet. Thai, this Item
ail be given new consideration in the nest
?P dsr'. -
? Bistitep Air lioice trio, Wriatiligion, D.C.. Holton.
_AS In SUS Mae .,of Port ifyer, va?..
nentios believed that Wend provision moat ?i"."
be made to provide adequate quarters toe Sealer
bachelor military personnel in the Wash. Burton_
Mgt= area and, Maoism', restored 114 roil- ,k4",isr
lion of the amount requested for troop n,??..??"-"'"" 'Inn"
housing at Bolling Air Faroe Baas The -
original request made by the Department
and deleted by the House amounted to $6.0
million. The House receded from its posi-
tion and accepted the Senate amendment.
813M1KAZT OR TIM I=
Differences in dotter authorization
As the bill passed the House, the total
authorities granted amounted to $1,636,-
828,000.
The corresponding authority granted in
the Senate version of the bill totaled $1,-
686.861.390, or .49.033.380 more than the
House version.
The total agreed to by the conferees is
0.425.000 more than the House version and
$43,608,000 leas than the Senate version.
Total authorization, fiscal year 1964, as ap-
proved by House-Senate conferees
New authorization:
Title I (Army)
Title II (Navy) ......
Title III (Air Force)
Title IV (Defense agencies) _
Title V (housing)
Subtotal
Deficiency authorization:
Title 1 (Army)
Title II (Navy)
Title III (Air Force)
Total
Title VII (Pleserve compo-
nents): .
Army National Guard
Army Reserve
Naval and Marine Corps
Reserve
Air National Guard
Air Force Reserve
Total
Deficiency authorizations:
Army National Guard
Army Reserve
5199, 633, 000
202.482, 000
488. 307. 000
24, 403,000
686. 312. 000
1,600, 177.000
9. 209, 000
07,000
166, 000
3.462. 000
7.600, 000
4.700,000
6. 700, 000
15. 970. 280
4, 600, 000
88. 470. 860
84.000
60, 000
Total 144,000
Grand total of all au-
thorisations 1, 642, 253,380
CARL Vursos.
L. Marna Rivas,
Pit1f.11. J. PICIZZIN,
Lsam C. Ammo,
P. Rasmus IIRRERT,
WAL711 Noesiss,
Friettua Saves.
Managers on the Part 01 the House.
CALL OF THE 110IISE
Mr. GROSS. Mr. Speaker, I make the
point of order that a quorum ts not
present.
Derails%)
'
Dowdy
Feighan
Feed
Fraser
Fuqua
Grant
Green, Pa.
Harding
Harris
Harsh&
"Itiseth
Nadi
Zell"
Laniderd
Loot. La:
Martin, Callte,....= -
May
Stiller, N.Y, tayler
Montoya /twosomes.
Morrison ThonspeoneN4,.
Morton. Md. Tollefson
Mend Utt
O'Brien., III. White
The SPEAKER On .thia =Wall 362
members have answered to their Barnes,
a quorum.
By unanimous consent; farther pro-
ceedings under the call were dispensed
with.
COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS
Ur. MILLS. Mr. Speaker, I- ask unan-
imous 'consent that the Committee on
Ways and Means have until midnight
Monday, November 4, -1963;40111g a re.
port on HR. 8969, along with any mi-
nority or supplemental views thereon.
The SPEAKER. Is therectohkaction-te'''''
the request of the gentleman' from Ar-
kansas?
There was no objection. '
???????????-
CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY
RETIREMENT ACT OP- 1963 ?El'OR
? CERTAIN EMPLOYEKS
Mr. DELANEY. Mr. speaker,- by di-
rection of the Committee on Rules, I
tall up House Resolution 843 and ask
for its immediate corusMeration.
The Clerk read as follows:, ?' _
Resolved, That upon the adoption eit-thle
resolution It shall be in orals to snows that
the Houle resolve itself Into The aisnardttes
of the Whose House on the State of the
Union for the consideration of the Mil (21.R.
8427) to provide for the establishment and
maintenance of a Central Intelligence Agency
Retirement and Disability System /or a dm.;
lted number of employees, and for other put-
'poses. After general debate; which shall
confined to the bill and shall eantIrme nat
to exceed two hours, to be equally divided
and controlled by the chairman and ranking
minority member of the Committee on
Armed Services, the bill shall be read for
amendment under the tive-gusrme rule. At
the conclusion of the corunderation of .the
bill for amendment, the Committee shall rise
and report the bill to the House with such
amendments as may have been adopted, and
the previous question shall be considered as
ordered on the bill and amendments thereto
to final passage without intervening motion
except one motion to recommit.
Kr. DELANEY. Mr. Speaker, I yield
30 minutes to the gentlewoman from
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? CONGRESSQNAL
cork (Mrs: Sr. Grout) and periti-
? at,,1 yield myself Such time 'its I
Y.Perisrte? ?
;Bpeaker. House Resolution' 543
for.. consideration of H.R. 8427,
irtivide for the establishment
intenence of a Central Weill-.
,AgenCy" ritiretnent and disability
Mclof a iinjted, number of employ-
end-foie
? er purposes." The reseal-
an 'open rule with '2` hours
att.
sirekent t:trie all employees of
*tIlntelligence Agency are Urn.
ltd the ,normal civil service retire-
? ment'benetita. On the other hand, more
liberal retirement benefits have been in.
? effect for many years for the Foreign
Service and for certain personnel en-
gaged In investigation and detection of
crime and apprehension of criminals.
Many CIA employees serve under condi-
tions which are at the least as difficult
and frequently more dangerous than the
? conditions which led to improved retire-
ment benefits for the Foreign Service and
certain personnel of the FBI and other
agencies. CIA employees who will come
under the proposed system are obligated
? to serve anywhere in the world according
tc 'he needs of the Agency, as is the case
in the Foreign Service and the military,
and unlike the normal civil service ern-
ploYees. It seems only right that such
employess should receive benefits similar
to those benefits received by 'Foreign
Service personnel.
Mr. Speaker. I urge adoption of House
Resolution 543.
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. Mr. Speaker, I
yield myself such time as I may con-
sume.
Mr. Speaker, this resolution, as has
already been stated, makes in order the
consideration of H.R. 8427 to provide for
the establishment and maintenance of a
Central Intelligence Agency retirement
and disability system for a limited num-
ber of employees, and for other pur-
poses.
Mr. Speaker, the Committee on Rules
held hearings on H.R. 8427 on October
9, 1963. The Armed Services Commit-
tee hearings and the report on H.R. 8427
stressed that only those employees en-
gaged in the conduct and support of in-
telligence activities, meaning hazardous
duty or service in foreign countries, will
be eligible for an improved retirement
and disability program. This, of course,
we all agree is right and proper and,
Indeed, necessary.
Mr. Speaker, during the Rules Com-
mittee hearings it was brought out that
the bill 'itself did not contain the lan-
guage limiting the program to em-
ployees on such duty, However, in
the course of our deliberations it was
suggested that an amendment would be
offered by the committee. To this, T am
happy to say the Committee on Armed
Services and the subcommittee agreed
wholeheartedly.
Mr. Speaker. it Is my understanding
? that this amendment will be offered on
page 3, beginning at line 13 and going
through line 21 This would tighten up
the bill. It ail] write into the bill exact-
ly what the committee Intended. It
will make a differential between people
ho are performing simph ordinary duty
in CIA
hazardous bcCupdikto
Mr. Speaker, I Ulpkyit1i
amend-
ment there is . certa14y no objection to
the bill nd,..I.-Fge tht adoption of Ui
rule. ?- '
Mr. 00.988, ,
gentlewoman Veldt'
Mrs. ST, GEORGE. 1 Yield to I-U.T committee
friend. the . gentleman from Iowa (Mr has
Mr.GRE. iTias ;ny
given to the Con ti Committee on Rules
why this bill Went to _the CoMmittee?On
Armed Services of the House .of, Re1,-
resentatives rather than to the Com-
mittee on Post Offices and Civil Service
which handles other retirement legisla-
tion?
Mrs. ST. GEORGE.. Well, it was, My
understanding, may I say to the gentle-
man from Iowa, that the CIA has usually
been under the Defense Department.
Therefore. it was considered proper that
this should go to the Committee on
Armed Services. I do not think there
was very much questioning on that par-
ticular subject. may I say to the gentle-
man from Iowa.
Mr. GROSS. Is the CIA subject to the
jurisdiction of the Secretary of De-
fense?
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. No one seems
to know to whom they are subject. I may
say to the gentleman. One cannot find
out how many people are employed in
the Agency and one cannot find out ex-
actly what their duties are. We heard
varying figures. It is a very hush-hush,
secret organization.
As long as the gentleman brings the
subject up, I think we might also say
that Americans are not very accustomed
to dealing with cloak-and-dagger or-
ganizations. This is one, perhaps, that
we are not too well fitted to discuss.
Mr. GROSS. I am sure we all had dif-
ficulty finding out what part the CIA
played in the Bay of Pigs fiasco.
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. I agree with the
gentleman. It is very difficult to find
these things out but, perhaps, that has
to be so in an organization of this kind.
Mr. RYAN of New York. Mr. Speaker,
will the gentlewoman yield?
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. I yield to the gen-
tleman from New York.
Mr. RYAN-of New York. I WU inter-
ested in the remarks of the gentlewoman
concerning the CIA and the cloak of se-
crecy surrounding it. I am reminded
that there are a number of bills pending
In the Congress. I am the author of one.
-House Joint Resolution 145. which would
establish a special watchdog committee
over the CIA. Certainly recent events
in South Vietnam confirm the need for a
Joint Committee on Foreign Information
and Intelligence to oversee the CIA. I
hope the Rules Committee will report out
one these bills with as much expedition
as this bill has been reported out. -
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. I am a very hum-
ble member of the Rules Committee, so I
can do very little in assisting the gentle-
man in his desires.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Mr.
Speaker, will the gentlewoman yield?
Mrs. ST. GEORGE. I yield to the gen-
tIcrium from South Carolina.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina_ Mr.
the
WasctVit.
Act. 'It is as'
It Is reaponsiblejo
United Stott*
Mrs.' SZ gri4R.OW-1.
tion .
def env of our eistmtrilh
Proper that it Should beim
tleman's committee.
Mr.' RIVERS of South t,a, tO
gentlewoman is absoltitely poi
Mrs. ST, GEORGE.
yield 5 minutes to the geritle
California IMr. Suva],. - --
(Mr. SMITH of California-.
was given permission to. r
tend his remarks.) -
Mr. SMITH of California. ,
Speaker, as stated by the, gentleyck
from New York, there were quest/0E4'
the minds of members_of the Rules Co
mittee as to whether the la:ttguage?14 ,
this bill will do what the proponents"'
want it to do. Accordingly. -certain:
amendments were worked out. The
gentlewoman from New York [Mrs. ST.
GEORGE] showed them to me, and I itultr ?
gest.ed that the language be further tied
together to make certain that we are re
erring to those employees abroid'It
are Also pngaced in 41:ip,tardous WOii
The amendment- does not do - that,
will include every employee working
abroad. At the time, told the-gentle-
woman from New York ? (Mrs. 'ST.
GEORGE] that evert if this amendment
were agreed to. that I Persona,' would
not support the bill. :-
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina.' Mr.
Speaker, will the gentleman yield?
Mr. SMITH of California. I yield to
the gentleman from South Carolina.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina.,
assure the gentleman right now that is
not, the intention, that is as thet.,(04.fol.
man stated it. . ? .-
Mr. SMITH of California. Th;t
the way your amendment reads. -
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina.-
do not think so, and we do not oaneliter
It as such. In my later disetutalen_k.
will cover the history of this leg...4146p,
to that there will be no question *Pout;
it. - _ -
Mr. SMITH of California, I think It
would be much better if-we took sections_
1 and 2 and placed them in this law 104
that we know that, rather than making__
legislative history, so that the two would.
be tied together. I personally am not support of this particular bill., -
Mr. Speaker, I am not refusing to sup-
port this measure because I do not be-
lieve that the employees are entitled to
it. My refusal is because I just do not
know whether 0: :1.,t they are entitled to
it I know No I,tt;.- rt!Jout the CIA and
their act1 itlea. thaz I no not wish to pass
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196s Appfoved Foteemsgailak
_fartherfsgtilaliorkwhichwillH' farther**. feanklio
&UM.* 'bet* luulsdadeA:- lairukhchey
right it that lthaii, the naspensibility about au. then * de; aq
to isle that Ooluitreu not:Only hail the bury lime 111-
,
'
100050011=2
to know moileibOat ? Men of
that the tielqb011,0t"
tieditiltitidrthat'aentneWitegabese;!4 ? do not know the annual*Olt -00h*.
the Rottee4411 Emote committees -*et It would not =lien* if It Were
Direaiori than *Minos rilliall?e ? -
tieing& established. But even en
Cf)naultteet"111Vrelell U4416?11?6 would think of dans anYthjur to
I dile lot lenew how ilitentaghly they our security. -so %imams po .Me
check the, settrities 4:4 the VIA.' should have some *eel eliettMi
41iPperrillae7Ot 4,111PiergiO, Sabotage, Sialtehdog towniMillwe
Sant liteibeetioia elemntinlistir and inter- fhit and
nal seettrity imentigeitoris In the Los `upon ihd With the CIA so that
Angeles 'ankle of the PSI prior to and rest of the 'Members would have,
during s Portion of World War it, r am
aware that this work is sometimes has,
ardous. There is no doubt that if-the
CIA is 'doing its job in espionage and
eounterespionage, that some of the em-
ployees are engaged in hazardous work.
Butin many ways, it is probably no more
hazardous than that of the PSI, the
Secret Service, the Narcotics Bureau, or
for that matter, the daily work of many
policemen here in Washington, D.C.
repeat. Mr. Speaker,! am not cupoe-
trig this measure because / do not think
CIA is deserving of it. It is because of
the fact that I know so little about their
activities. am not criticizing the CIA
or commending them, because again I do
not know enough of their activities to
take either position. But do have
some questions in my mind that I be-
lieve should be answered. And I believe
they can be answered without Interfer-
ing with their activitie& How Many
employees are there in the CIA?-1,000,,
5,000, 10,000. 15,000 or more. I am in-
clined to feel that there are probably
more than 15,000 but hive nothing to
factually so state. 'How Many employees
are there in London?
England has its men intelligence and
counterintelligence people. We are claw
allies. If CIA Is engaged in counter-
intelligence activities in London, they
certainly must be working directly with
appropriate English authorities. I
would like to know the answer to this.
Certainly if the English authorities had
any evidence of espionage in the United
States, or wished any Information, they
could send one man to see Director
Hoover of the PBI, and appropriate in-
vestigation would be commenced within
the hour, throughout the United States
If necessary. and the English investi-
gator would be kept completely in-
formed. if there are 200 employees in
London, which I have heard, but cannot
state as a fact, what are they doing? I
think we are entitled to know something
about this, Mr. Speaker.
Testimony before Rules indicated that
this measure would apply to about 30
percent of the employees. I ask 30 per-
cent of how many. I also think we are
entitled to know something about what
their activities were prior to the Bay of
Pigs in Cuba. I have beard rumors that
their information was incorrect and that
the CIA was greatly responsible for this
horrible event should Members of Con-
gress not. be entitled to know of these
activities and to in some way have at
least a little control over the CIA? Very
emia 14 time thiOnt )icm- mien
ohndluth?et * Prnslident- Board ofbotil r congrewgreai teelteanteence In n? Vern*, ;-'ims. AallekterstmotT. it.1.1.4khertier.
In the Senate on the 27
geova."-!1/417 abolders the 0.11:421itrpi,
te
re
thMis,3de.; ? .
Idea as to what is going on. whetheLire - Sir. A -Will thegeniI
we doing ow' lob so far the ',coed frotithle?tiptat,iki?'
concerned, and whether or not leteidee? ALBPRT. I am not MA'
tion such as the 'Pandit* bill Is wag- ? tomakes conunitment, at
ranted. 'Mr. HALLECK. 31r. Spai,
After the hearing in Rules and the kenteeputit sew? ,-
hewePaPer summate' I. received er)Me lir. AVERY. X seeld to -mil'
anonymous letters /roil persons testing igh .
tahed odhorio, &touter,
they were eunkneiee the ,?840.HALLECEI., 1; would Just4?Iiit*441,
of the comments were:
asy to the.. gentlemen. and lee, all ltat
If CIA were bent on wrecking the morale members at she moose. I have hart the
c4 its smPle= it fwaid not nnd a tea"' test solicitude for the. Malthus' ?
instrument this vicious piece of leg- .
*dation which will sweat in attracdng an convenience, and I residinti, of tom" the
Inferior group of sesPlelees' situation that confronts our noiletiguee,
and so far as my ova persons' situate)*
Another quote: Is concerned. I would litre tit tnow, in
I personally Imam benent from this bel. advance what we coo figure, oh and de.
but lt " ?avians Just in inT envie tani al" nand an es to the anrangemente.
bill will result in a lessening of the inter- _ _
iave
est and dedication of CIA eanployees. APOiren it/ maiorii7 leader Wei
ready employees in their thirties are roaming distinguished Speaker of the House about
plans to get advanced degrees by going to the whole situation, and as ler es lam
night school., thereby lessening the etrectere: concerned, I want to say to ea friend.
new of their daily wort, in order to get $ the gentleman from Kansas. I Shall do
better position outside when 'their 50th birth- vs ow to try. to work oat some advance .,
day comes around. I suggert that you con- bounce ot the yew
suit not the "chiefs" but KOMI or the NICa- sais"11 - ""'"
dialle. in CIA to gain a true wicture of what West= sinitszertaY. we er going 40r be
Is involved in this proposed personnel posy. here until we start on. ione2aairegeleeliette
. AVERY- Then le
I repeat once again, Mr- SPeaker' that Mr. 31r
Speaker. to nonnative; it liege .
I have no intentions whatsoever of outs; what I have . h'! Ives the, imam_
gulthed majority lender and the .11ille
everything I can to help. But I hist
ing any harm to the CIA. I want to do
Unguished Minority, 'leader,AliM- 'the
canna 11149eit thusthy Itirti,n3er, statement in the other body-that this
compound a mestere. ??? sedition Is going to be "backeto-badte
posed to this measure. wtth the next session-4 this a zessone
? Mrs. ST. 0E0E0E. Mr. Speaker. I awe asamption that we probably win
Yield a thinutee the gentlemen fresh continue In tauten to thee Chiestmas
Kansas Mfr. Amy]. holidays? Would the gentlemareereira
Mr. AVERY. Mr. Speaker, I urge the to ed to
adoption of the rule. It has been so well arishbrsa owe ?opt
Mr. ALBERT. I think the gentlemanexpfurthlaienret coI could add.thillreeveofrrl Yiringotioe has the same knc"Led_Fe221?...the
the presence on the Boor of the major- Ily! _Program as 4.1"
ity leader, and would appreciate blast- Oklahoma. ?
tention. I notice the other body was ad- Mr. AVERY. The gentleman ,Ol
viseci yesterday as to how they might Oklatiorea pals me a great tribute And
proceed to plan for the weeks ahead. I am not sure it IS, deserTed,
it was helpful indeed to learn that their Mr. ALBERT, I em pre U tnie,
Thanksgiving recess has already been I am sure all the Members of the douse
fixed. Their Christmas schedule has ale know what etIII.,*_aa
ready become a matter of record. I won- Ing which inese' be akted tipOie
der if we could be privileged to have the ? think the statenient that the gentleMarl
same information in this body, refers to as having been, made. In the
Mr. ALBERT. 31r. Speaker, will the other body could well be correct, But I
Sentleman yield? want to Join the .diStingnigh_ed Irdnorlq
Mr. AVERY. I would be delighted to leader In doing erei 7tlitng eitn. anal
yield to the gentleman from Oklahoma. am sure that in saying this I speak, for
Mr. ALBERT. First of all, this is a our distinguished Speaker of the House
matter that would be cleared on both also, in trying to determine when and
sides of the aisle, but I would like to how much time Members of the House
remind the gentleman that the Veterans' can have off consistent with the legisla-
Day vacation in the other body is from tore responsibilities of the House of
November 8 to November 12. That Representatives.
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: (41
.1 0-
,
proviali queetton we. /t'1:3t..,.4 r
" %-
?
;011161.014404 MIS agreed to..
-iitotinteln.gticonaider was 104 on tbS
5C-V6
? 4: 7:1'; ."av #"."7"!"!. ?m-il!!".7."'- ?
FLtr411014..ratopiscrriTR',
-Mr. Speaker;
it privilfged.rerieintickti: and saki: ,
ltnnkeditittt "lionstderst4
The 9ictlyri-ii: read as 1114.,00. Avnt(li.e
et`41441;0044, honey ligeteig-s
elakots,.be..seet ne 7,000Pera eet.. P
502'
tegen
tq. wonder
I:108114m up for
-the remainder of -.this -yeer it, raigh
- net tuilloUneecl; UV, the 4,oiree., rather
standirig contanttee at the ?tiats -.IMPrefeeff..*Arent-ent,
t -A,61,..nel'r,aeTttl.r4veg Gri Interior an.fI Thauiir `M.00,105 nt'ara-urtPr-.J:Atn, .tttiaN-
- ? ittiOetno attglatieltre:,,
-agreedst,9 ' ? " .?? Pertinent. to;
tin
kl ell are
than through the ?newspapers and over
the radio.
14,r A,LBERT 6Peaker will the
tI;Linall yield?
" Mr. AVERY. I yield t4 the gentleman
Mr. ALBERT. I think that any an-
nouncement that the majority leader will
make. and I am sure I am speaking for
both sides on this matter, will be made
first to the House of Representatives and
not first to the press or to anyone else.
Mr. CEDERBERG. Mr. Speaker, will
?
the gentleman yield?
Mr, AVERY. I yield to the gentle-
man.
Mr. CEDERBERG. Would the dis-
ting-uished majority leader advise us if
It might not, be possible rather than to
have a new session start on January 3 to
have it start later on in the month and
to request the President to bring in the
state of the Union message and the new
budget message late ln January because
we will not be finished with the old
budget anyway until we get the new one.
If we earl get that,,maybe we can get a
oeuple,of days eacatlom--% - -
Mr. ALBERT. Mr. Speaker, will the
gentleman yield? ..,
Mr. AVERY. I yield to the gentle-
man.
Mr. ALBERT. First of all, that would
have to be done by a joint resolution or
a concurrent resolution because the law
requires that the Congress convene on
January 3. I think here again it would
depend on the legislative situation. Cer-
tainly, it would be a convenience to the
Members individually, and to me per-
sonally, if we could do so. That Is os far
as I can go at this time with respect to
that sort of arrangement.
Mr. COLLIER, Mr. Speaker, will the
gentleman yield?
Mr. AVERY. I yield to the gentleman.
Mr. COLLIER. In the light of the
urgency of the problems before the Con-
gress this year, is it possible that we
might run Into this situation during the
two national conventions in 1964?
Mr. AVERY. That question should
certainly be more properly addressed to
one In a position more able to respond
than the gentleman now in the well.
May I express my appreciation to the
gentleman from Oklahoma, and I am
sure I speak for all Members present, for
the enlightenment we have received to-
day.
I yield back the balance of my time.
Mrs ST. GEORGE. Mr. Speaker,. I
have no further reqUestS for time,.
The t*iickl;dtkork (R. it4;4
. point .q
ato n' to ."reeeetaidee a with 'PeePOzt,14:t. Attila
the table.
considered
, Pea, . ,eln
gated in writing to serve anywhere in the
world that Agency needs would require.
Upon my initial assignment to the CIA
subcommittee, it came as a latepriee, to
me to learn that. all Agency employees
received only the normal *II ?pervtoct, Se-
tiretnent beneflta. I had asionned'there
was a program to afford.earlier sitire-
ment, such as that availabto,to the Foe-
sign Service or the benellta offered to
agents of the Federal Bureau of Diets* "
gation, which enables the agent to re-
tire voluntarily at age 50 upon coral:de":
(Joe of 20 years of service.
The CIA's need to have ?a young And
virile group of career people =tanning
their oversee posts needs tio. elabbrar
tion. I became personally convinced Ott
the need for this type of Rregraiti.,a4 a,
uy duty, 1 days'a W , 4?),
CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY
RETIREMENT ACT OF 1953 FOR
CERTAIN EMPLOYEES
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina, Mr.
Speaker, I move that the House resolve
Itself into the Committee of the Whole
House on the State of the Union for the
consideration of the bill (H.R. 842'7l to
provide for the establishment and main-
tenance of a Central Intelligence Agency
Retirement and Disability System for a
limited number of employees, and for
other purposes.
The motion was agreed to; accord-
ingly, the House resolved itself into the
Committee of the Whole House on the
State of the Union for the consideration
of the bill H.R. 3427 with Mr. 'brows
in the result of months of brieiblits,preeen_ teal -
CT.balr,,,;m3urritt op. Tux wHoLz? Mite; CarivialbeOces conin:HROtAtetttute,mubltarritUSP .
The Clerk read Utle of ? the bill. ings on HR. 8427 convinced me that this
legislation is the apprriprlate, Inest.t?-
Put into effect an Unproved retirement
system, ?.?."?
Now, as to the legislation: ?
One of the key features is the right 01 -
the employee to apply for voluntary re";
Urement upon reaching age 50 a hyauut
a minimum of 20 years of aerVici. Such
retirement, however, must- be with .the
consent of the Director, and In pedal
cases where a man's &entices'. bret'
needed he will be required, tck' MM.
the Agency's requirementehaog
met, :
. Another important feature of Ullabill
is the authority of the Agency:to retire
people when It is determined that thilti
the beet course of action. In this. Stem.:
ton., where the employee 114it, eadc
of 06-14 and aboee he wil1;,*pon being
retired, receive an, iounediate suundty:
regardless of age. Ate amount of tills
annuity in the case of a min With 20
By unanimous consent, the first read-
ing of the bill was dispensed with.
The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman
from South Carolina Mfr. Reims] will
be recognized for 1 hour and the gentle-
man from Massachusetta [Mr. BATES)
will be recognized for 1 hour..
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Mr.
Chairman, I yield myself such time as I
may require.
Mr. Chairman, H.R. 8427 is a bill to
give the Central Intelligence Agency a
better retirement system for a limited
number of its employees.
At the present time, all regular em-
ployees of the Agency are oovered by the
normal civil service retirement system.
Many positions in the CIA do not war-
rant special retirement treatment of
course, but about 30 percent of the total
employees work under conditions Oieti
clearly require an improved retirement
and disability system.
I would like to point out that this leg-
islation establishes no precedent since it
was determined that the Agency retire-
ment system should be patterned after
that now applicable to the Foreign Serv-
ice.
Careful examination indicated that
the Foreign Service system had sufficient
flexibility and other improvements to
meet CIA's requirements. The CIA pre-
sented convincing proof that those ern-
years of service would he 40 percent ot
the highest average annual salary for
any 5 consecutive years. ? The? tleeinlitr
tee examined this provisi6ri most care-
fully and the bill H.R. 8421 -reflects a
change we made that in orde4te qualify ,
for this immediate annuity CUte individ-
ual must have had at least 5 years of
what is termed "qualifying service,"
which means service of a nature which
would fit him to be covered by the system
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(pLye,41 For Release 2002/03/20,:f
CONGRESSIONAI,
ve had- at?lean.
the Agency.
mci?should
tiTe Of an-
',Periods of both
end 'service
person, kivolim-
08-13?or below
b may elect Cf baa at least 5 years
toilette? his
el, and draw a'
de( ato. Or he may
slily re, 'Contribution& In
addition he Wetild grant,eil separation
Pee' based on elilorittee sialax7 for each
ye ar of merebies'bUt hi no event to exceed
a total of 'L year*- ti :Salary. The commit-
tee believes this prevision is genera/
In line" wttli'ltopsestiort compensation
available in militare service and is not
unreasonable wlerea Man has joined the
Agency with the-expectation of a career
and because of shifts in requirements
Is unable to beesetained by the Agency.
This separation compensation will per-
mit him a period of readjustment. pos-
sibly taking necessary training to equip
himself for a position in industry or in
another branch of Government
I believe this new system win be an
extremely valuable tool in the manage-
ment of the Agency and will materially
assist in attracting and retaining the
extremely, high caliber men and women
the Agency needs for its demanding pro-
grams. As indicated by the published
hearings and the report, the Armed Serv-
ices Committee has looked painstakingly
at this proposal and has examined
Agency witnesses most carefully. Where
necessary, the committee made changes
Item the oeiginal proposal, which you
will end in the report,
The cost Is reasonable, leveling off at
about $580,000 per year.
Let us turn for a moment to the re-
cent press criticism of the Central In-
telligence Agency. Obviously such criti-
cism is not the proper basis to form a
judgment on this bill?indeed it is not
a proper basis on which to form a judg-
ment of the Agency itself. The scope
and ferocity of these press attacks
brought a response?not from the Agen-
cy which very properly should not and
, does not respond to press criticism?the
response was from the President. He
was asked about a recent story on CIA
In his press conference on October 9. I
quote his answer:
I must say I think the reports are wholly
untrue. The fact of the matter is that Mr,
McColl. (CIA Director) sits In the National
Security COUrteil'? ? " we have worked very
closely together in the National Security
Council in the last 2 months attempting to
meet the problems we faced in South Viet-
nam. I can find nothing, and I have looked
through the record very carefully over the
last 9 months, and I could go back further,
to indicate that the CIA has done anything
but support policy. It does not create pol-
icy; it attempts to execute it in those area*
where it has competence and responsibility.
I know that the transfer of Mr. John Rich-
aidson, who is a very dedicated public serv-
ant. has led to surmises, but I can Just as-
burs you flatly that the CIA ham not carried
0.11 il,dependent activities but has operated
ur,cler close control of the Dircctor of Central
Ititel!igence, operating with the cooperation
-RDP7.8e03721A000100050011-
SE.*:.
of the ioutt;i4feeenrity-Ooun
my instructions ? 'lee .1 thinic they have. done
A 1300d SOO. ,
Ass Member of the CIA SilliconiMittee
of the Muse AENXid 5el:910ell COgnmitkoe.
I believe I am also in a position to Mike
a judgmerit on the Apiece. In My ?Mul-
len, I believe the Agency is doing se bril-
Dant Sib under most trying etrann?
stances "
For those who contend that the Con-
gress falls to exercisCguperrisiozi Over
CIA, I would like to state the facts.. The,'
Armed Services Committee has legbilae_
tire jurisdiction over CIA and for rtsnY
years, the gentleman from Georgia [Mr.
Vreisoel has appointed a subcommittee
whose sole function is to review Agency
activities. This subcommittee present-
ly has as Its chairman, the gentleman
from Georgia, Mr. Cage Vinson, arid I am
proud to serve under him on this sub-
committee. The other Members are:
EDWARD HEBERT, WINDY Pace, CHARLIE
E. BENNETT, GEORGE H17DDLESTON. JR..
LESLIE C. ARENDS, Wneette G. BlUiY. BCE
Wresox, and FRANK C. OSME1Ull, die.
As a matter of policy, the subcommit-
tee has endeavored to meet with the Di-
rector and other Agency officials at least
once a month to conduct an examina-
tion of its activities on a worldwide basis.
In the course of these hearings we re-
ceive substantive intelligence briefings
to keep us up to date on happenings
throughout the world. It is the purpose
of the subcommittee to fully inform it-
self on all aspects of Agency operations
Including its organizational structure
and personnel practices. The Director
of Central Intelligence has emplaned with
the subcommittee the most sensitive of
Agency operations in order that the
members be fully informed.
At time I, as a member, am concerned
with the sensitivity of the; information
and its serious nature for fear that I
might inadvertently endanger someone's
life or a highly successful operation.
The Director of Central Intelligence
has been most candid with the subcom-
mittee in discussing plans for future ac-
tivities and we have witnessed a num-
ber of significant improvements in the
Agency since the current Director has
been in office. On occasion the subcom-
mittee has deemed it necessary to con-
duct thorough reviews of the Agency to
assure itself that all possible steps were
being taken by CIA and the intelligence
community as a whole to insure that
adequate intelligence is available to those
who must make the policy decisions?
further, to insure that polleymakers
have the benefit of as full information
as possible including skilled evaluation
of the raw information utilizing thor-
oughly professional analysis and re-
search.
As to CIA conducting independent op-
eration in pursuance of its own policy,
the subcommittee has examined very
closely the machinery by which the
Agency is in fact responsible to the pol-
icymakers. Under the existing proced-
ural machinery, the Agency simply can-
not operate independently nor does it in
fact operate as a policymaking organ of
Government. The Director is directly
responsible to the President and estab-
itrnsiedttsee irietiTet
tions at the Agency are In
netecl with and responsive US thalpolictes
of the -Government. I Migh
this is true not only et the
but it is also true at the,
In foreign coUntrica where
mount role of the Ansbaseador
eepted by all agencies. ,
However, let us return
which is the lame totter. -
The committee hag u
ported this legislatiOn;"
Members of the:Rouse lee
merit& l am sure most
It favorable. _
Before I ?or/elude. I would.
vise the House that .1 propel() to
amendment to aft. 1422 to ofititic
kind of duty that must be,Perforinetles
before the +Director can: designate the e
Individuals who will be permnted to Pere
ticipate in this liberalized retirement
system.
I discussed this matter with members
of the Rules Committee and members of,
my committee, and I propose to offer
an amendment to sec on 203 of the M.
Under this section. as it is now written. -
the Director may designate the officer,
and employees who will be entitled to -
the benefits of the system. The amend-
ment I will offer would change the lan-
guage to read as follows:
On page 3, lines 13 to le, strike out
the first sentence of section 203, and sub-
stitute in lieu thereof the following lan- -
guage:
The Director may designate from time to -
time such Agency officers and employees
whoa? duties are determined by the Director ?
to be (I) in support of Agency actisitlea
abroad hazardous to life or health Cc (U) Jo
specialized because of security requtrallentil-
as to be clearly distinguishable from normal
Government employment, hereafter ref-creeds
to ea participants, who shall be enUtlid to
the benefits of the system.
Mr. WAGGONNER. Mr. Chairman,
will the gentleman yield?
Mr. RIVERS of South Cerolina. I am
constrained to yield to my friend, the
gentleman from Louisiana [Mr. WAG -
CONNER I.
Mr. WAGGONNER. I have been ad- .
vised that in this proposed legislation
there are the usual prohibitions against
drawing retirement pay in eases involv-
ing Personnel who are reemployed by the ;
Government by some other agency: is
that correct?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina, That
is eight The gentleman is right.
Now that is the bill. Let me sum-
marize it for you again:
First. Retirement at the age of 50
with a total of 20 years of service, 5 years
of which must have been with the.
Agency. The employee must apply for
the retirement and receive the permis-
sion of the Director.
Second. The Director may involun-
tarily retire individuals and where they
are in the grade of 08-I4 and above,
they will be entitled to receive an imme-
diate annuity regardless of age _pro-
vided, however, they have 5 years of
qualifying service and a total of 10 years
service with the Agency, and
Third The Director may retire em-
ployees in the grades of GS-13 and be-
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roved For RtiltiatigitaesiMMI. ilLIKAIRD8-EiStOtifebo 100050011-2 October
their lives and are in danger et7leeill"rie11-1'e7ic34V?e
their lives. / Wish r 0001a lei thilieeeeepine.?What_I think Is a' gook
Mittee the areas where these pebte are In tower echelons of peop
languishing in jails and where they -have, :Performing clerical and j
faced firing squads all over the world. It ;work they are geting salaries
Is a terrifying thing. If you kne*Weiat . people Aolnir similar or exsi
I know, you would ear to me that there Werlitin ether agenceikof
area lot better ways of makinga4ving'. Meittaieletleirilt_e 'Th0.:01O.ife
than working for the CIA.'2wOttlelee shi:eCOMparable polikkp
?Mr. HOLIFIELLI I am glad the gen- er flete:for that. Do you have
tleman brought this point out becmtie. MeriltOMake on this? -
as a member of the Joint Commiteeken ..M:r.'ItIVERS off iScititek
Atomic Energy, we have had. OlOWyJa aleCtieie a bit of comment to
tionsliips with the-CIA,. We know Whist" idief"rddnot oeueselti.n. ,
the gentleman from South Carolina "aye - Mr, JONES 'of Misseani$
Is true, that there are people who have,from a sienoi that r think Is
served in this organization who are in appreciate the fact that" this.'
entitled to
notion' inethe
Salary for r: ' each
Of 1* yea
simian; Will
th daitlina.
rnan ..
t'f-ePrould 'like to
ti man from South
eubeetnittee; the
teeMbers of the full com-
mittee te?r bringing this bill out. As I
understand it, this covers a personnel
areieNviiitelhas not been covered hereto-
fort:. it 'affords retirement privileges
identical t,o those in the Foreign Service;
ia that torrect? The grades under grade
0844 are ?already covered by the normal
civil service retirement regulations.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. The
genlleman referred to grades under
GS-14? -
Mr. HOLIFIELD. Yes, under grade
08-14.
egr, RIVERS of South Carolina, Not
all qualified employees normally em-
ployees are covered by the civil service
system. Let us call them agents.
Agents without the qualifying service are
not covered.
Mr. HOLIFTELD. In other words.
agents who do not have the qualifying
service under civil service are the ones
who are not covered; is that correct?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. That
is correct.
Mr. HOLIFIELD. But under this bill
they will be covered and the benefits they
will draw will be similar or the same as
thgee of Menke In the Foreign Service.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. That
is correct.
Mr. HOLIFIELD. You spoke of the
right of the Director to retire agents
under certain conditions. Does this give
the Director any additional power to fire
or hire people besides the power he has
already?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. No,
but the Director must have this au-
thority.
Mr. HOLIFIELD Yes, he must have
this authority. Your reference to them
is to see that they get certain annuities
In case they are relieved of their duties?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. That
is right?to give them security. You
rnest remember these agents sign a let-
ter before they go on duty that they
will serve anywhere on earth. 7 days a
week, 24 hours a day. It is a very de-
manding service.
Mr. ,HOLIFIELD. That is correct.
Many of these people being covered by
this bill have served in places where it
was dangerous for thein. They have
assumed duties in espionage which have
endangered their lives and, in fact, some
of them have lost their lives as a result
of this service; is this not true?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I am
delighted that, the gentleman asked that
question. The gentleman has asked a
question?if some of these agents are
serving in dangerous places and have lost
jail and some have lost their lives. Fur-
thermore, they are also in. a sitiuttion
where they cannot be protected Of they
cannot be claimed as a member of the
CIA in the event they are captured .and
Jailed in a foreignesountry.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina: If I
should tell you how many of these agents
we have on! I should give you some sort
of a number of the agents that we have,
the Soviets could merely by a matter of
arithmetic figure them out and ferret
them out.
For instance, when the Director de-
cides to separate a man he cannot go into
court with his case under this bill, be-
cause if he did, any espionage 'person
could figure out exactly who these peo-
ple are, how many they are, and what
they do. We cannot permit this. This
espionage business is a dangerous busi-
ness: it is not one that I would be in. We
have never been in it before. But, has it
ever occurred to you and to the other
members of the committee as to the vast
system of the Soviets? They have thou-
sands upon thousands upon thousands of
agents in this world. We must have this
agency and we must give them this
benefit.
Let me say this to the gentleman: we
permit the Federal Bureau of Investiga-
tion employees to retire at an earlier age
than other people. Do you know why?
It is because they are under such a ter-
rible strain all the time. They must be
Oven this right; otherwise they will
shake themselves to pieces. They have
to have it. and this organization here
must have this.
Mr. HOLIFIELD. I think the gentle-
man has done a good thing in bringing
out this bill. I want to express my sup-
port for it. I believe every Member, who
knows the workings of this organization,
who knows the dedication of these people
and has had the privilege of meeting
many of these people in the course of
their congressional duties, can certainly
subscribe to this. I hope this bill will
pass unanimously.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I
thank the gentleman,
Mr. JONES of Missouri, Mr. Chair-
man, will the gentleman yield?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I
yield to the gentleman from Missouri.
Mr. JONES of Missouri. Mr. Chair-
man, one thing the speaker has not
brought out is the wage differential that
exists between persons employed in the
Central Intelligence Agency as compared
with those employed in other agencies of
Agency has to operate under anYal
great secrecy.
Mr. ?RieTER13 of South Cam
certainly.
Mr. JONES of
times they are inclined to- catty'
ridiculous. For inistanoi: had*
perience, and I am going to lebite
Order to 'einphasize the point ratit,
to make.' At the time of the tee2101014etie
I was concerned about what hattleeneeee
pened there. I think our Govert=tee.
suffered great damage because of..eeeeeee
ments that went out at that thsie4hlielts-:: -
were not true. So. I made an apriailit-T'-:
ment with Mr. Dulles to talk to bins
about this thing. He tried to explain it , -
to me, but I did not get much infonnae.
tion.. In his old headquarters therbat.
a picture of the new CIA building. Just ? -
out of idle curiosity more than anything
else, I said. "Mr. Dulles, how maw pea-
pie will be employed in this new build- -
ing?" He said. "Oh. we cannot tell you =
that. That is secret." Tome that was an
asinine *reply to a question, because
think anyone knows that there was
secrecy with regard to the number of I, -
people to be employed in that new.buildeeee
lug out at the Central Intelligence Ageri- -
cy, because anybody who knows any:.
thing about trying to estimate the num-
ber of employees in a building could have,
gotten it very well; or for that matter
one could count the employees entering
and leaving by public highway.
The thing that disturbs me about this
bill is the fact that it has been the prac-
tice throughout many years for these
people to take advantage of their sensi-
tive position and to use it for privileged
treatment which is not justified. , _
, .
I am in sympathy with the people who
risk their lives and do things like thee:7 ;
I am not asking you what the salary' ok
those people is. but. I have reason to be-
lieve that it is a pretty good salary which,:
takes care of some of the hazards and .
the 'risks that are involved.' I think thosee._
things have to be considered herd, ?
I think your committee should have and should be be able tcetell me to what heights
or depths we are going to go to deter-
mine who is included, because unless I
am badly mistaken and unless I am badle:
mistaken in my estimate of the operae,.
than of this department in the past, they -
are going to start reaching down, down. '
and down to get people up. I have had
the experience of observing people 'quit,
other departments of the Government to
join the Central Intelligence Agency.
They have told me. "I can go there ant
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1963? Approved For akstatiggaQ3/20 ? CIA-RDP78-03741AGO*305001172
KMAL -1tEcoRrt-Hovsv-, ,
-tateet3if?, aie, 'same -work that v baVe regulations are Paid on exactly the.
as
Bey. -in the Depart-
ment of ;Agriculture "s.nd?I will get
? much higher. eatery, because I get
ceiterage tinder the MA." Yet that Per
sett stays In this same community an
does the same work with no greater
sponsibility, and he gets higher pay.
do not think that type of employee is e
? titled to any special consideration
because be Is associated with an metier
et has a percentage of its peo-
le ivho are -put in these PesitiOne Of high
sensitivity and who are subjected to area
rusk and, in mealy instances, have giv
their Wee. / do not think you ha
given Us enough information shout these
people at the lower levels, who consti
tote a great majority. I would wan
some assurance that those people
not going to get further preferred trea
ment Under this bill. I would like to ha
the gentleman allement on that.
. Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Th
gentleman has made a pretty good
speech. I do not know where to star
to answer his question. I allowed him
talk for 5 minutes. What question does
he want me to answer?
Mr. JONES of Missouri. I asked th
gentleman first if he knew of the Mt
ferential in salary between the peep'
employed doing clerical, filing, and tYP-
ing work, who were getting paid morthan e
comaerm.IJON
gentleman should know it. I think his
hose
not know that.
Mr. RivER8ttee 8hpeooulES opofdlfemst; uwththurieict..adre:oprmtaniainkel,n think thttshd
a fOrlitiAlg the same duties.. We. are net , ThtT?Ptitielit stene.vity:
the talking, About those employees tn
- bill. This bill carers only the empl 4Arrq
d who are engaged in liPeotall7Pal of woelte.:
re- With lelineet- to other bands of Jettle.: bitiinan'"
I ployees?the average ldrid?let me set'ugeti ` for his
n- to Mae gentleman that a few years 440 atr; JONES
wet edeployed as a staff member of my Men,,Wilithe gentle-Mint
subconunittee, an attorney who was theti4?.: -Of
on the legal staff of CIA. paid lthifliP,'Yfiddgto the ,gentletibui,
little bit snore money than he was Salt% .0Z:er,inan.lc*Efit,, of t
t jog down there. I am sure that he ;;;It Akan Aki -
en been getting at CIA exactly the semi' *one question for met'
vu Pay he would have received for &railer the gentleman thinkee that thL
work in any other Federal aeencY, instilled as a maister_oftiZererie ag
- hope that will help the gentleman on number of employees am..
t the point that he was making, in this CIA building here in
are Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. May ton? _
t- gay this to the gentleman: The people Mr. =mow or south
CarOls
ye who do similar work are covered 1:iy the 'think so. _ 4 -12
regulations of the civil service. . Mr. JONES of Missouri. The getttlee,'-'
o Mr. JONES of Missouri. Mr. Chair- Mari thinks that should be aeorett
man, I do not agree with that for this Mc. RIVERS of South Carblini. C'T
reason, because I have had gpecific in- think so. T?
te stances and have known people who Ur. ASH:BROOK. Mr. Chalemart;...
have tit& jobs in one department in or- make the point of order that a etteenin:,
der to go to work for the CIA. They is not present. ?.
e have told me that they were doing exact- The CHAIRMAN. The Chair *Dr'
13, the same type of work and getting count. One hundred and nine Membervi'
Paid at a higher grade than they were are preaent, a quortua. ?
,
in the department that they quit. ?Mr. BATES. Mr. Chairmeli, I yield
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I ani myself such time OA I LOAF OdhartMe,
o surprised to hear that. Mr. Chairman, H.R. 8427 iv a bill
Mr. MacGREGOR. Mr. Chairman, unanimously reported by the 'Armed
will the gentleman yield? Services Committee. Its purpose IS
to
e Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I am establish an improved retirement ilyatten
pleased to yield to the gentleman. ? for those employees of the Central Intel-
e Mr. MacOREGOR. Mr. Chairman, I ligence Agency who are concerned with
was particularly pleased by the cone- the conduct and support of intelligence.
merits of the gentleman from South activities abroad. ? ? '
Carolina with respect to the nature of hie The Congress has long countenanced r
committee's knowledge of the work of the.. the policy or provictiniready.rothyseientt-
Central Intelligence Agency. This IS for certain lasses or Government ma,
Particularly so because from time to tinie ? Mmes. This pot* is not one of fa=
over the past 3 years we have heard corn- voritism, but one of realism. It takes'
plaints In this body and in the other body account of the fact that some jobs Are
about the need for the establishment of a.- more hazardous and more trying, than.
watchdog committee which, in ray oPhi- others. An appreciation of the risks
assumed by specie/ agents of the 711I
and other Govertunent employees gaged in in the apprehension and deterrtf40
of criminals, led to the Congress Prge-
viding early retirement for them. - The
arduous conditions?climatic and other6!
wise?under which Foreign Service nal-
cers labor, dictated the .ertactment
similar early retirement provissions.' In "
the case of those CIA officers and em-
ployees engaged in the conduct and sup-
port of intelligence activities abreact
both criteria?zhazardous and onertitis
working conditlons?obtain: - This is-oh-
viously a young mates' bualniels and'fer
the sake of consistency and Justiee,
vision must be made to accord to this
limited number of CIA employees the
realistic treatment which presently gove
ems the early retirement of FB/ agents
and Foreign Service officers. :The mime
tary retirement features of the bill meet.'
this objective by providing that an em-
ployee who is at least; 50 years of lege
and has rendered 20 years of service may,
with the consent of the Agency, be re-
tired on an immediate annuitY.
Since the Civil Service Retirement
Act continues to be appropriate for the
great Majority of CIA employees, this
House is entitled to that information.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. The
bill clearly points out who would be
covered.
Mr. JONES of Missouri. I respect-
fully point out that it does not.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I
must be stupid. because I have tried to
explain that to the gentleman.
Mr. JONES of Missouri. I do not
think the gentleman is stupid. I think
sometimes the committee is overawed by
the great secrecy under which this
agency operates and some of the people
have taken advantage of their position
to keep secret some things that the Con-
gress and the gentleman's committee
particularly are entitled to know.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I
will tell the committee What I will do.
The gentleman may go back and ask
the counsel of our committee to answer
any of those questions: and he can an-
swer them a thousand times better than
I can.
Mr. JONES of Missouri. Does the
gentleman mean that these things are
;so secret that we cannot put them on
:record?
Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, will the
gentleman yield?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I
yield to the gentleman from Virginia
Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, as a
member of the subcora.mittee I may be
able to shed a little bit of light on the
point that the gentleman from Missouri
has raised. As far as I can recall from
the testimony the employees who are
covered wider the normal civil service
on, is not indicated from ray knowledge
of the existing committees of the Con-
gress. I should like to call the gentle-
man's attention to a response given by
President Kennedy to a Question at a
press conference earlier this month when.
he said the following:
There is a congreesknial committee in the
House and one in the Senate composed of
members of the AppropriaUons Committee
and the Armed Services Ccenmittee, and they
meet frequently with Mr. McOone, and he
also testifies before the Foreign Relations
Comraittres of House and eenate and the
general Armed Services Committees. And r
think that Congress through that organist-
ton has the means of keeping a Ration with
him.
I should like to ask the gentleman
from South Carolina [Mr. Rams]
whether he agrees that the committee
on which the gentleman serves and other
committees mentioned by the President
do maintain effective liaison over the
work of the Central Intelligence
Agency?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. We
o it all the time. The gentleman from
Georgia [Mr. Vresorr] is chairman of
that subcorrunittee and its members meet
all the tune We et all
the information
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only to those actively on-
Once work overseas. For
,..t.he various position tie ,
mitered have not been
bill itself. but the re-
been made explicit
the bill and in its
?
,
efiSpecialitlea needed by the
Iligence Agency vary. not
"anphisticatien of intern-
ri techniques. but, with
id conditions generally.
the "-U-.1 and the Mtn-
"for highly trained photo-
inter ? ti a clear example. But
with the progress of science and the
Imaginative. technological advances in
this area some specialized skills used by
CIA Officers in the field may become ob-
solete. Such men often find themselves
involved In thefl Agency's necessary pro-
grams of managed attrition. Authority
was therefore granted to provide such
Individuals who are involuntarily retired
either separation pay or immediate an-
nuities. Immediate annuities are avail-
able only to 08-14's and above who have
at least 10 years' service with the Agen-
cy, 5 of those years in a career primar-
ily oriented toward the conduct and sup-
port of intelligence activities abroad.
Those involuntarily retired who are not
eligible for immediate annuities will be
Provided with separation pay which, like
the annuity, is proportioned to length of
service rendered.
Though the retirement provisions of
this bill represent new coverage for some
CIA employees, they are not novel to the
Congress. Identical provisions obtain
for Foreign Service officers. Neverthe-
less, each section of this bill Was care-
fully analyzed to confirm that it was ap-
propriate and necessary. In the course
of 4 days intensive hearings the com-
mittee found that a number of changes
were warranted. These changes have
been made, and as a result we have be-
fore us now an excellent bill which I am
proud to-support--a bill which deserves
your consideration_ One change in par-
ticular was occasioned by security con-
siderations. Because of the sensitivity of
Information pertaining to the mission of
the CIA abroad, a section was added to
give finality to determinations made by
the DireCtor under this act. Similar pro-
vision exista in the Atomic Energy .Act
and is designed to protect highly classi-
fied information from disclosure in the
course of an open trial or hearing.
Other changes were made which
tightened the bill and which reflected
the years of experience which the For-
eign Service ha., had in administering an
Identical system.
I believe that H.R. 8427 is in line with
consistent congressional policy and that
It represents an equitable retirement sys-
tem for those involved in this arduous
work. In addition, It provides to the
Central Intelligence Agency a method
for keeping its service young and up to
date; and the enactment of this bill will
demonstrate to those whose thankless
task it is to be in the front lines of our?
inteligence-collection service that their
work and their welfare are not unheeded
by the Congress of the United States.
605001
gen r';W:7?tkinto'
yield 'th)Vrge'it:11:enies4"741d:i;bkontiased lL
. mr?.HAWY.- In cobnectglIith,,t4eZ, man, as a
trile800_-_.4;11410,117 AO; Misso ?
the extent to which the Jucommi$,tee 8427.
went- Into 'This bill fqg
tieman: 'agree that th.hierings*itio the due. "_ ?
CIA the subcommittee went very deeply inent fo:r
Into this itinttei :or the lirettelt .fitteltb*,,-!4grAcY who
of ernpfoYe*...tn::be a0Vered. t-neder,tbig conduct and su
bill?, ?q?-??
BATES. OR* 80 percent of
Mr. HARDY. And I think the poilit will be brought in urAcsr
that the gentleman from Missouri raised Today, all.em140teem
Is a very important POint. :But I think:, under the notarial civil sera*
It is also important that, the Members of plan and the majority of
the Congress 'know that the inbcorne will renaain under that .SYS
mittee did receive assurances to the .ef- lee which is enntlbuettely:,
feet that only Persons In Very' special Monte Abroad iecittlires tun
kinds or assignments
wenitsth wed?uelileenbeeemteverueecie many erfougrnir In a?W1 Ia)setIngli thi
ton-
particular bill.
Mr. HARDY. That is correct. I
thank the gentleman.
Mr. JONAS. Mr. Chairman, will the
gentleman yield?
Mr. BATES. I yield to the gentle-
man from North Carolina.
Mr. JONAS. I wish the gentleman
would tell me where I can find that in
the bill.
Mr. BATES. What is that?
Mr. JONAS. The limitation of cover-
age to hazardous foreign service. It may
be in the bill, but I cannot find it.
Mr. BATES. I may say that an
amendment will be offered on this point.
The members of the subcommittee after
we considered this particular aspect at
considerable length in the committee
were satisfied in our minds as to what
the CIA intended. When we went be-
fore the Rules Committee they raised the
same question that the gentleman from
North Carolina now poses. We wrote an
amendment which we offered to the sub-
committee, and we also cleared it with
the Rules Committee. With the excep-
tion of the gentleman from California
[Mr. Sierra I they are presently in ac-
cord with what I have previously stated.
This will be discussed when we get un-
der the 5-minute rule.
Mr. JONAS. Can the gentleman tell
me where I might find a copy of the
amendment?
Mr. BATES. I will lend the gentle-
man my copy of the amendment.
Mr. LINDSAY. Mr. Chairman, will
the gentleman yield?
Mr. BATES. I yield to the gentleman
from New York. and the entire intelligence_ ynity47:..,,
Mr. LINDSAY. For how long do they I have haterwd with great in -
have to serve overseas?
Mr. BATES. In order to -obtain this
annuity an individual must have 5 years
in this particular group. If he has I()
years' total he could retire on the basis
of 2 percent per year.
Mr. LINDSAY. Five years of oversee
assignment?
Mr. BATES. He must be in that work
for at least 5 years.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Mr.
Chairman, I yield the balance of the
time remaining to the gentleman from
Florida Mr. BENNETT I,
f4,4i;a4-,ox
"r7V`4,,7.1:, qUtialgo0
'JR N
ters.
Foreign Service early recognized,
need for a retirement system
to meet the needs of an oversee eeryi
and beginning in 1924 the Comas*
ognir.ed the validity of theselAipettiel
needs.
CIA is not asking for something ape-
dal or unique in this bill. The
ity of improving the retirement
was studied intensively and It_
termined that the system develoPecl-b4
the Congress for the Foreign Service
over the last 30 years would meet Agency
objectives. Consequently, this hill gives?,
to a fraction of the total Agency person-
nel a retirement system substantivelf
identical to the Foreign Service:1,
? During 4 days of hearings an 'Weds
.of this bill were examined intensively'
the committee. A review of these hat
ings and the report indicates deli*,
most careful thought Was given t9..."..c11.,
aimect of the bill. A number of smend-7,
menta were made which strengthen ind
tighten the bill. The bill was amant='!
mously reported and it is to the merits'',
of this bill which the Members should
address themselves. -
My membership on the CIA Subcome:
mittee has given me considerable lnsIght
into the personnel problems and the
management aspects of the InteltIgene,e. _
business. It may well be that the
Agency has made some mistake*: buViitil,?,
all make mistakes. On the othe4lignk,_
the Agency has been tremendottety,suez7__
cessful in providing advance Infortna-t-
tion on many aspects of world ...yenta,
I am convinced that our polio:Makers'
are getting good intelligence from.,04...??
the Problems of CIA ooerstere
intelligence in the field. These mere
women I have found to be trulYttedic?te4L,
to their tasks. and the Nation'sherild be
grateful for their efforts. Tliis
essential to maintain the high
the service of which these PeOPF.:4
part. We must give the Agency the
it needs to accomplish the extremeliedif--
ficult mission which it is assigned.
I call upon you to vote for this bill
which is recommended to you by all
members of the Armed Services Com-
mittee and not to vote for irresponsible
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..
d For Release 2002/03/20 .:..pi?,,Rbp7
NGREssioN4
' 'f..-:
of our, " ?-'1"his .1a: no MY:that': ., ,
7;... has, been without IOW 119Nr*O0PaS.:-
my re- , '''PerrisiOrt::".., Aio,t:s .../Ials's,nitt..A1/05P
t?Is
te**e,;,,Mitlli-,noi,31:: . ,. -.-14 9Pe.r,u...
'em' and it it' Wei likewise _. Set31 . , sIty''
lousee.1'''. APProPriations7Stilsonlinitittee; . us
*kb'regud to the as the initie0M0340.aasOfsql,:P0114eis'iS
.ii,- iiticutiiii. on- 't-'0*ikoiindeloil*cfty-op,.ioital ,
? -t 4ug- this 'is the igiboonuni-Oem` titea; has- dealt :WI
Of the ? VtteXn..tvill agree A4att:Dir.n.e.
biro' or, mec6ne and his deputies have
generally d0 not , times been respOriireS le :iliessq
tees*' tnieltje, we haie, rsisect-..,.-Vileilliiiq
In the- WWI ,
? 1963
hese
pr
Mr. ,
m013'
been
&MO
and
?
nevi*
other
? print
?te atithe present ?sated?to give tia 'detail* and
time. So X'whidd think, if questions are
in the Minds ot Members of Congress, it
might be 'an aPPrePriate thing for these
Member* of the COngress to treat the
Committee on Armed Services and its
CIA /subcommittee just 48 they treat
every other committee of the Congress
and address to them the questions they
have with regard to employment policies
or with regard to any other Policies the:,
may .have, and in this way perhaps some
of this unnecessary secrecy can be re-
moved.. There * a degree of secrecy nec-
essary irt the CIA. but there is also a large
area where there is no real necessity for
secrecy.
I think Members of Congress are
mostly interested in seeing to it that the
books are properly, handled and things
of this type. Things of this type can be
brought to the Central Intelligedce
Agency subcommitee and can be Prop-
erly handled. I hope in the future Mem-
bers of Congress when they hear about
a subject dealing with the Central Intel-
ligence Agency and have a question about
it will suldrees their question to the staff
of the committee or to the committee as a
whole and /to the gentleman from
Georgia, Chairman Vntson, chairman of
the subcommittee and of the whole Com-
mittee on Armed Services. I think you
will get intelligent answers then to the
questions you ask. Perhaps by eliminat-
ing this frustration we may not only
serve the CIA but, more importantly,
may serve to strengthen our own coun-
try.
Mr. ARENDS. Mr. Chairman, I yield
myself such time as I may desire.
Mr. Chairman, our Committee on
Armed Services has had a subcommittee
on the Central Intelligence Agency for
many years. M a member of that sub-
committee since its inception I have be-
come somewhat familiar with the na-
ture of the Agency's organization and
its manifold activities. Our subcom-
mittee has regularly inquired into the
CIA's operations and from time to time
have made specific inquiry into some
specific aspect of its activities. When-
ever a question would arise as to what
Che CIA had been doing in some parties
o'er area, our subcommittee would
quietly but thoroughly look into it.
Naturally, all our subcommittee In
investigations, and briefings were
in executive session. Naturally, no re-
ports have been issued as to our findings
and recommendations. To do so would
destroy the effectiveness of the Agency.
and the importance of this Agency's
work to our country's security cannot be
too strongly emplia?Azed.
are no 1332,re
re Arent *
comecti
? rittion*., -
great
;t,o
flea.7eirtain type ?
iertake -Plligemea tes
' some
-
theRI!
Lbe fiffia.:46its -i**1)-n
e U-s:voluntary
r-
e er
C'emPloYees at the *n50
to
into complete confidences, Nor bare they oIA net 1041147?
rvice
hesitated to admit. to isdattible.errieriheir and -YatreataY tne se' .T#Ct
their eagerness to' improve tipon Others to dedicate themserees.S.
Meths's& of obtaining' inforniation arier..AYPe
Of works BY. this. .14ellislatian,?
evaluating it. Anyone familiar tc a
the simplest type .cit detective one of the most important sten
readily recognizes how readily errors ocs'Cicvernmen _ ? 1::;,'"
cur in ferreting out the fact S2s. The gath- .4 urge we enactment of this ?? s
ening of factual information on a worlds' Mr. IdecOREGOR. Mr. Chairma
wide scale, and being certain that the will the gentleman yield?
Mr. AMENDS. I am pleased to yield"!
information is factual and not just con to presents problems beyond de- to the gentleman.
. Mr. MAcCIREGOR. Mr. Chairman,
scription.
it is frequently said that there need* to.
For my part. I believe that in the CIA be a watchdog committee established*
we have one of the finest intelligence the Congress to oversee the activities* of..
agencies in the world. I should also like the Central Intelligence Agency. It Is
to say that I do not believe anywhere
said, for example, that such a group is
will be found people more dedicated to needed, consisting of House and senate
the service of our country than Director Members of long seniority and demon-.
McCone and the people who serve under ?strated responsibility. I ,should like to
him. ?ask the distinguished gentleman from
There is one thing more I should like?? Illinois whether or not there is not al-
to emphasize with respect to the CIA. ready in existence in the Congress a cora-
Contrary to what we read and hear from mittee, or committees, consisting 01
time to time, the CIA does not pursue an Members of long seniority and demon-
independent foreign policy. The agency strat.ed responsibility to oversee the, so-,
does not make policy. It simply gathers
tivities of the Central Intellignce
the facts upon which policy may be. Agency, ?'?
based. It simply eat-ries out orders dies- lir, Aftsims., The answer to,that -
tated by those who make policy.If "Yes." As I said in my talk a moment
there is an inconsistency, or a seeming ago. a ahioommitto of the Armed sem-
inconsistency, between policy and what ices Committees of the House and Senate
Ni 174 ---14
the CIA may be doing, it arises not be- and the subcommittee of aPProPriatiOns.
cause of the CIA acting independently. go into ail matters concerning the cm,
Our subcommittee has not only re- and it is my opinion that thesis, commit-
viewed the operations of the CIA, but 'we tees do as good a job as we possibly can.
have also looked carefully into the ma- If our present committees were to be en-
chinery by which the CIA activities are
coordinated within and between other
departments of Government.
While all this is not directly related
to the bill before us, I felt at least some- information of the most secret natUre
thing should be said concerning the might soon become public information
operations of the CIA generally by those and no longer be a secret matter. Isionlik
of us who have had opportunity to regu- prefer our present practice. I thistle We.
larly study its activities, do a thorough job. I must say, in corn-
As has been pointed out, the bill be- mendation of the CIA that when ,they
foreus was reported unanimously by our appear before us. they are very.' frank,
committee, What we are proposing honest, and sincere and at all times ready
here is not new. We are In effect aim- to repry in detail to any inquiry of any
ply extending to some of the emplofees kind whenever we request it.
of the CIA the same type of retirement Mr. MACGREGOR. i3econdly, it1i
system
system as we have had for the Foreign said by some of little knowledge of the
Service, existence of the Armed Services Corn-
We established a special retirement mittee and the Appropriations Subcom-
system for the FBI and for the Foreign raittee, that a watchdog committee is
Service in recognition of the extraordi- needed so that Members of Conaress
nary hazardotis nature of the work and would be kept informed of the general
the uniqueness of the service itself, activities of the CIA. You are informed
Assignments overseas are not at best at the present time, s.re you mat
the most desirable, particularly for any Mr. Artmirrs. We certainly are in-
extended period of time. And many of formed. Our chairman, the gentlemen
these assignments are necessarily in un- from Georgia (Mr. vrestosl, whenever
healthy climates and in places where something comes up, frequently requests
*reed into a so-called watchdog commit-
tee composed of Members of the Rouse
and Senate, I think it would soon get
out of hand with the real possibility that
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IRetea ..e .Z002101/..20 : CIA-RDP78-03721A009100050011-2
AL RECORD ROI/ " October 80
- ,
Chai
Man. we itriimirnecio ,ci , ,
er sorrttute to the
:because we could not even andentvote a the
ow many supergrades they had. the,sObstitute fails. "
two?I think it was th 4 j34TEIL
were advised that ther would
time, es Ile may
:c Mai of secrecy7.
to u?nnnJ
it.thi'CTA ho ? persons they had In those,REra of
t, is It? gradis.8o on Is bt't we it'lth.to.-71;tigathrveZttetitenorPittraleettelint:liatliesii-eliiisecontraiill 4141"ItTntellliegtH-
Agenq
fed that just inok'der:to'get just the number of tool:tient and
-,4is not a policy- In those ,thr
, three categories.. grades -4;;417re.,,,ttocovioes,
'2P-.0I1CY Is Mr, RIVERS of South CarOlituoit*O. oageojoy taioido olOia
? ?
? o?ooio authority Uhairnien, will the gentleman yield 4?---.4....oloirtem, sinillar to -tba?.
o,00-
? o36 sq. ? ' ? GROSe I yield to the gelaebbillo .0.18n aeriice PrimenPir-e '
000 atacq1111. ?611.? idr? Chairman. I from South Carolina There is a clear need to estahlish-tind
eia& the 'gentleman from Illinois for Mr. RIVERS of Sou. th Carolina. Xitt maintain a young ca .rw., ;intelligence -
2* his -elucidation, the first instance, when you asked them service. This bill Will facilits.bi-tihat
Mr; nntERs of south Carolina. Mr. how many they had on the payroll, they purpose, , o?
'Chaifor,..rM,ert, to have no further requests should have told you. I think it was Equality, Mr. Chairman, would like to
Ume? - ridiculous not. to have told you. - pay tribute to the men and wcenen of
the Central Intelligence Agency who free
quently serve at the risk of life and limb
In difficult parts of the world. Their
service, which goes unpublicised /or the
most part., should be recognised by the
Congress of the United States and their
loyalty, their dedication, and tiseiropro-
fessional character should be backed ny
by a meaningful career service and re-
tirement system.
Occasionally Mr. Chairman, points
are raised that the CIA operates inde-
pendently of the chief of missions.
Just by way of clarification I would like
to read from one of the Executive orders
bearing on this so that there can be no
lack of clarity on the fact that CIA in
any embassy is subject to the Ambassa-
dor. Former President Eisenhower on
November 8, 1260, issued a memoran-
In the last fiscal year retirement fund d. um which I will excerpt from Stated:
went $4 billion in the red. You had,toet-, It La my desire that. ell sPProSkrieSs!stePti
ter begin to be concerned about hoW you be taken to assure that the ebhif of
handle retirement from here on out., be-
cause somebody, and soon, is going to
have to put money into the fund in order
to pay out any retirement.
Mr. Chairman. I could hardly believe
it when I picked up this bill over the
last weekend and read this one sen-
tence:
The Director may designate from time to
time such Agency officers and employees.
hereafter referred to as participants, who
shall be entitled to the benefits of the system.
Mr. HATES. Mr. Chairman. I yield
,
such time as he may consume to the
gentleman from Iowa (Mr. GROSS'.
(Mr. GROSS asked and was given per-
mission to revise and extend his re-
marks.)
Mr. GROSS, Mr, Chairman. if I may
have the attention of the gentleman from
Illinois (Mr. ARILIVDS1, would like to
compliment thefl House Armed Services
Committee on being able to get any and
every type of information which they
wanted from the Central Intelligence
Agency. That has not been the.experi-
ence of some other committees of
Congress.
Mr. Chairman, I would have appreci-
ated it had the gentleman went on today
and told us who in the Cuban Bay of
Pigs flase,o fell fiat on their collective or
Individual faces. I would have appreci-
ated ,nearing, an account of why the
'CIA's Merl; Richardson, was removed
from Vietnam if the CIA is not dealing in
Policy in that COtirltrY.
Mr. Chairman, it was my understand-
ing that Mr. Richardson was brought
back from Vietnam because he was try-
ing to establish some kind of a policy.
I hope that some day, when we do not
have anything else to do in the House,
that members of the Armed Services
Committee will tell us of some of the
things that we common garden variety
Mernbent of Congress have been totally
unable to-learn about the operations of
this-AffencY.of Government.,
.Mr..--telutirmin, let me say that the CIA
at one time came before a committee of
which I am a member, the Committee on
Post Mice and Civil Service, asking for
additional sopergrades. We asked the
representatives a the CIA how Many
supergrades they had at that time. The
answer.was. "We cannot tell you." al-
thoughthis was an executive session. , I
said, "Do you mean"to tell the commit-
tee you cannot divulge how many em-
ployees you have in categories 16. 17,
and 18?" They said, "No, we cannot tell
you." I said, "We are not asking for job
descriptions, we do not ask you for
names, we simply ask you for the num-
bers of employees in the three cate-
gories." My friend, the gentleman from
Michigan (Mr. JOHANSEN! Is present on
the floor of the House and I am sure the
gentleman will corroborate what I say if
there is any doubt.
Mr.? GROSS. We are dealing in Part
with the same sort of thing in this bill.
I will tell you why. In the report ac-
companying the bill you do not have a
single letter, or the usual letters from a
department or agency of Government
in support of or in opposition to this
legislation. You have nothing whatever
from the Chairman of the Civil Service
Commission who administers the Gov-
ernment retirement fund. And, let me
tell Members of the House that you had
better begin to be concerned about the
retirement fund.
Mr. Chairman. I favor certain pro-
visions of this bill, but I warn you that
the Government retirement fund is to-
day more than $38 billion in the red. I
did not say "millions." I said billions:
$38 billion in the red.
I could not believe that a retirement
bill could come out of a committee as
Unlimited as that.
Sure, you are going to offer an amend-
ment now to partially close the door.
Apt with one hand you are going to close
the door and with the other you are go-
log to open it again with the amendment
which you propose to offer.
I am going to offer a substitute to
your amendment to keep that door
closed.
I support the proposal to give proper
consideration to those engaged in work
hazardous to life and health, but there
I want to end.' I am not going to give
the Director of the C/A the authority to
interpret what is normal employment, to
open the door again, and perhaps give
an unjustified number of people on fast
retirement who May be completely un-
deserving.
LTA. diplomatic mission Is effective in dia4
charging his role as the representative-of the
President. The chief of the mission shall
have and exercise affirrnative responsibility
for the coordination and supervision of all.
U.S. activities in the country to which be is
accredited.
Further, former President Eisenhower
In this memorandum said:
It is my desire that the Chief of Mission be
made fully aware of his responsibilities and .
authority In respect to U.S. activitielL
The Anal point in this Executive order.
that has been continued. I believe. by
President KennedY, states explicitly that
the Ambassador: -
Will report promptly to the President as to
any matter which he consider* to need :our-
rection and with respect to which he is sot
empowered to effect correction.
? It is / believe plain that under the TO=
ecutive orders of the pest administration
and the present administration.' the Cen-1*
tral Intelligence Agency and its rePree-
entatives are responsive to the President
and to his personal representative. the
Ambassador. -
In a word, Mr. Chairman, there is a,
definite need for this legislation today.
It will mean a great deal to the spirit of
the Central Intelligence Agency. These
men and women deserve well of the Unit-
ed States. It is my hope that the Con?
grras will enact this
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proved For
itorrevue ute fur;
e.' the' Clerk
Raftimaige itvediaatikawo 0 91 00050011-2
_
?mos horioisway. pis:ea* ber death OtHil tef et 'ttda SWUM!, Ve,tted tsr.
the stew or gene he' maratelle to lite Par;* elebdrein til) 0125; MICA,
ad and who* incapable of pelf -support by the number ot ,
wi:by raison oe mental or, pia:Word disabilitr. Ca) a suretirint wife or flualuinat
and, who received more than one-beit of Me the =nifty cd child * termini
/Mete Iron Hanle support from. such partioipant. antrittim ref any retn dren
oy the Vaned Mater of (3) "(WIC raw* ea unmarried- recOmputed and peat as'
diftlyfirikasternbled,_ under the age ot eighteen pima. Or AP* htliband, or child Wei, -00,
&VD Deiencolosts enraarried child regardiass ne. PeritniPant.
cause Of physical or Mental diethility in- terThirrannuitir Farb* e<
ely na Act Apulornerbeif
a atm:4 (elerlfthIpport. Int irtaltitittortgbacabe egaPaingtna ,t4r orA?
this Act. tha rot:drat more than oneelealt at his support, dighteen4 justemai excep,tripiet...
=sum theL Central' Weill- from the participant.
or physical d ty, the lain
7; and rase a?onacrumoar 003musdrioriti terminable may when "tot
Pant.
thoh cuffed peace ale inebtasn, incapable of PWEleilklihtblaLectrdr ugh rill
0WitiOnigrn01?,101", term inchides "(1) An told and (il) , fish. thereto slab be
IS".!-frifIX! 0914 , * stepchild or natiral rigid 11130 death,? marrhqpr, or
tor" means the Dire:ant of Con- sea 3111. (a) Efts and one-half per cantinamarries. or roomer, ftwor ,anch
of the b sary veceived by each partlei.i (to) Any immansed partietpont
int eideal
? *mover pant shall be eoatributed te the futut for t he under the prorfokor, of th r is 4to sod
r o
Terse u-..,?Tent INTIssismtter s annulties, cash benents. refund. the inteebee 10 be roe
ill01
Orelenaneer Joni DelaMerrr RIOT= paymen
=,liairre-adereetrailimearr eversat
contributed front the respective appropriation unity. in neu 01 the annuiti
01 and agoiranese. An equal awn +Than sup ber :the. tune of retiremsbt elect sired
:Mae* and ntrastlowe
Vie Dina= maY Prescribe salary The amounts deducted arid withheld
rules end regulations tor the establishment from imago salary together. with the amount," having an, trerantble letterset (as ,
' ' ? or tund which is used for payment of bis
provided, said designate bi writing a
and mainterutruse of a Central Intelligenott so contributed from the appropriation or is need in rfitc. nava)) in thersef.
Agencylietinsinent and Disability System. for fund sham deposited by the Arm, a, the partt to receive an &amenity after par-
a limited number of employees, referred to credit of the fund. ticdpozt's death. Tree anettity payable as the
hereafter as tiae system. (b) Zech participant shall be deemed, to participant making such election shall be
reduced by 10 per avenue, of an arintlity
(b),, The Vdrecter *bail administer the sYs- consent find agree to such deductions froin comp d as provided in paragraph (I) et
ton tra s000rdance with such rules and regu- beam seamy, and payment tem such deduc. ute .
tattoos and with the principles established dons emu be a fun and complete discharge this section, and by 5 per centum otaniati-, .
by this hot. - and acquittance of an claims and demands trill e? computed fcr each full ave fulmrthe
(o) In the interests of the security of the whatsoever for an regular services during the person designated is younger than the per--
foreign intelligence activities of the tinned period covered by such payment, except the tielpant, but such total reduction shell not
States and in order further to implement right to the benefits to which be then be exceed 40 per centurn. The annuity of a'
the -proviso of *section 102(d) (3) of the Na- entitled nnel rthis Act, notwithstanding any survivor designated under this paragraph
Waal Beeitriti het of 1047. as amended 160 law, rule, or regulation affecting the i nutty computed se prescribed above. The
ndi- alien be " Per centum ?f the reduced an-
17.6.0. 40e(d)(3)). that the Director ie Oen- vidualat salary.
tral Intelligence shall be responsible for pro-
TAIT C?COStrITIATIOX or arretWrintS annuity payable to a beneficiary under the
provisions of this paragraph shall begin on
Sac Pd i. (a) The annuity Of a PerticiPant the first day of the next month after the-
shall be equal to 2 per avatum of his average participant dies. Upon the death of the SAW-
basic salary for the highest live consecutive. viving beneectery all payments shall oases
years of service, for which full contributions and no further annuity payments satthortsed
have been made to the fund. multiplied by tauter this at paragraph shshall1os due or payable..
tecting tntelligence sources and me
from unauthorised disclosure, and notwith-
standing, the provisions of the Adatinistra-
Uve Procedure Act (5 17.13.0. 1001 et seq.) or
any other provisions of law, any determina-
tions by the Director authorised by the pro-
visianisof this Act shall be deemed to be Anal
and ormeinaive and net subject to review by
any court. -
UstablhOsivisnit and eseinressence of hied -
Sec. 2102. There Is hereby created a rand to
be known as the Central Intelligence Agency
Retirement and Disability Fund which shall
be maintained by the Director. The Central
Intelligence Agency Retirement and Disabil-
ity Fund is referred to hereafter as the fund.
Participants
Sao. 203, The Director may designate from
time to time such Agency officers and em-
ployees, hereafter referred to as participants".
who shall be entitled to the benefits of the
system., Any participant who has completed
Whose . career at that time Is adjudged by ParaffraPli (a) at Ws section, UP tO the WI *tad participant has less than twenty years
fifteen- years of **vice with the Agency
the Director to be qualifying for the system amount of such annuity sPecified by Win as or servios credit toward his retirement under
may elect to remain a participant of such the tee* for the survivor benefits. -The ane the system at the time he is retired, his an-
system fur, the duration of his employment nutty of the participant making such election nutty shall be computed on the amumption
by the Agency end such election shalt not be shall be reduced by 254 per centum of any that he has bad twenty years of service, but
subject to review or approval by the Director. amount UP to 113.600 be specified as the bassi the additional service credit that may aocrue
for "the survivor benefit plus 10 per centum to e participant under this provision shall
Annuitants of any amount over *2,400 so specified.. in no case exceed the difference between his
Sac. 904. (a) Annuitants dual be Perttel" (a) (1) If an annuitant dies and is sur- age at the time di retirement and the. man-
Pante who are receiving annuities freer' the Axed by a wile or husband and by a child datory retirement age applicable to his grade
fund and all persons, including surviving or children, in addition to the annuity pay- in the Agency. . -
wives and husbands, widows, dependent anis to the surviving wife or husband. there . (b) In each moo, the participant shall be
widowers, children, and benenciaries of par- shall be paid to or on behalf of each child an given a medical examination by one or more
UriPants or annuitants -who obeli become annuity equal to the satallest of : 0) 40 per duly qualified physicians or sumo= des-
entitled to receive annuities in ac'xirtianee centrun of the annuitant's average baste ignated by the Director to conduct exami-
with the provisions of this Aet, salary, as determined under paragraph (a) nations, and dkasbUlty shall be determined
(b) When used in this Act the term? of this section, divided by the number of by the Director on the basis of the advice
(i) ',Mow" means the surviving wife of children; (it) 000; or (111) $1,800 divided of such physicians or surgeons. Unless the
a participant who was married to such per- by the number of children, disability is permanent. like examinationsexaminationsticlpint for at least two years immedietelf (2) If an anneetant dies and is not star- shall be made annually until the annuitant
preceding his death or is the 'mother of Intl* Tilted by a wife or husband but by a child has reached the statutory mandatory retire-
by marriage to the participant. or children, *oh surviving child shall be merit age for hie grade in the Agency. If
(2) "Dependent widower" means the sur- paid an annuity equal to the isnidiest of: the Director determines on the beefs of the
viving husband of a participant who was (1) 50 per centurn of the annuttent's average advice one or more duly qualified physi-
married to such participant for at least two basic salary, as determined under paragraph clans or surgeons conducting such examine-
the number of years, not exceeding thirty" rawr e-axinerns eccenneo ro =Mir "
Bye, of service credit obtained in aceordeates ? PaWriCtraIrra -
with the provisions of sections 261 and 262. -aee
In determining the &ingress* period of serf- Aettresseat for dieshaitY or raceliticisle---
ice upon which the annuity is to be base& readied/ cad mina tiort--reeneery
the fractional part, of a month. if any. +hen . sec. 941. (a) Any participant who has five
not be counted. yenta of service credit toward retirement une
(h) At the time of retirement, any married der the system. excluding military eirletfal
participant may elect to receive a reduced service that is credited in accordance With:
annuity and to provide for an annuity pay- provisions of section 251 or 262(a) (2), and
side to his wife or her husband, commencing who becomes tote.ny disabled or Incapact*f.
on the date following such participant's ts.ted for useful and efficient service by res.
death and terminating upon the death of son of disease, illness, or injury not due to
such surviving wife or husband. The an- vicious habits, intemperance, or willful
nutty payable to the surviving wife or conduct on his part, shell, upon his own ala-
husband after such participant's death shall plication or upon order of the Director, be
be 50 Per oentuni of the amount of the Per- retired on an annuity computed as prescribed
Uri ra annuity computed as prescribed in la faction 321. If the disabled or incepaci-
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:1959?
9114
?Approved F
erkftflarattlINtiti
914 argumatiknoOSICAteNPOSAtriatio
55 to ?Iir rant .? itymia jtoottItt tlikt,d4ut.
. Deaf* fa. servIce
? sem 232. (a) In olio it" partici t diaa
and no eisinsi for anneity is pa7sbIs
the provisions of thla' Act, his
to the fund, with 'interest at the Intik
prescribed in seeding 1141(a) ind 2el(i4?,
shall be paid in the order of precedence
shown in section 241(b).
(b) U a participant, who has at lend SYS
years of service credit toward retirement
under the *Plena, excluding military or,
naval service that le credited In aeleserdaneet
with the provisions ot section 251 'oe.
23240(2). dies before separation Or retiree
meat from the Agency and is survived bY
widow or a dependent widower, as donned
in section 204. such widow or dependent
widower shall be entitled teen annuity equal.
to 50 per centum of she annuity computed,
In accordance with the provision* of pars-
Eleselh (e) or thin seetion and of section:
221(a). Tb. annuity of. such widow or deei
pendent widower shall commence on the
date following death of the parteepant and
shall terminate upon death of the widow or.
dependent widower, or upon the dependent
Widowers becoming, capable of self-support.
(c) If a participant who has at least five
years of service credit toward retirement
under the system, excluding military or
naval service that la credited in accords:sot
with the provisions of section 251 or
252(a) (2). dies before separation or retira-
nient from the Agency and is survived by a
wife or a husband and a child or children,
each surviving child shall be entitled to an
annuity computed in accordance with the
provisions of section 221(c) (1). The child's
annuity shall begin and be terminated in
accordance with the provisions of. section
221(e). Upon the death of the surviving
wife or husband or termination of the an-
nuity of a child, the annuities of any re-
maining children shall be recomputed and
paid as though such wife or husband or child
had not survived the participant.
(d) If a participant who has at least Ave
years of service credit toward retirement un-
der the System, excluding military or navat
service that is credited in accordance with
the provisions of section 251 or 252(a) (2),
dies before separation or retirement from
the Agency and is not survived by a wife
or husband, but by a child or children. each
surviving child shall he entitled to an in-
nWty computed in accordance with the pro-
visions of section 221(c) (2). The child's
annuity shall begin and terminate in accord-
ance with the provisions of section 221(e),
Upon termination of the annuity of a child,
the annuities of any remaining children shall
be recomputed and paid as though that
child had never been entitled to the benefit.
(e) it, at the time of his or her death, the
participant had less than twenty years Of
service credit toward retirement under the
system, the annuities payable in accord-
ance with paragraph (b) of this section
shall be computed in accordance with the,
provisions of section 221 on the assumption
he or she has had twenty years of service,
but the additional service credit that may
accrue to a deceased participant under tele
provision shall in no en* exceed the differ-
once between his or her age on the date of
death and the mandatory retirement age
applicable to his or her grade in the Agency.
In all cases arising under paragraphs (b),
(0), (d). or (s) of this section, It shall be
assumed that the deceesed participant 111111
qualified for retirement on the date of Ws
death.
Voluntary retirement
Sec. 933. Any participant in the system
Who is at least fifty years of age and has
rendered twenty years of service may on his
own application and with the consent of the
Director be retiree from the Agency and re-
the
.441
xiPaPf.
Irin.LFWA, thirleidhei year
groin ery.lor determined.
ILIP04:4P reinstate
iiny,1400cl4ccket?d, ,dlsabltlty iennettenti Ini
the grade i.? 'Which he was *relies at time
of iretlreineht,.'eeiiii.'Plitnt4.:paay, taking
Into consideration The age, qt1Q,Bastions;
find expartericei:of such isneitilkirit;?1:and. the
Pr.sent:, OOP 43 the
4itenrY,14"410614"him to a grade higher t.tw4.
teuteolon 4440
thie.0141;leta?:?Istitiiree, to
ow:intent; , Man* iieter the
nate 'prilthic?ingaeoliiatigai:,:ahnW*.I.Aeoisey
Cr ? until the741,4110,,reinstatenient . or reap-
pointinent in the Agency, whichever to ear-
lier. Pees for eXeMtriations under this pro-
vision.. together.- with reasonable i traveling
and other expenses incurred in order to sub-
mit to examination, shall be pied out of the
lend.. If the annuitant fails to submit to
examination as required ender this section,
payment of the annuity shall be suspended
until continuance of the disability is satis-
factorily established.
(Cu If ? a recovered disability annuitant
whose annuity is discontinued is for any
reason not reinstated or reappointed in the
Agency, he shall be considered to have, been.
separated within the meaning of paragraphs
(a) and (13) of :section 234 as of the date
La was retired for disability and he shall,
after the discontinuance of the disability
annuity, be entitled to the benefits of that
section or of section 241(a) except that he
may elect voluntary retirement in accordance
with the provisions of section 233 if he can
qualify under its provisions.
(d) No participant shall be entitled to
receive an annuity under this Act and com-
pensation for injury or disability to himself
under the Federal Employees' Compensation
Act of September 7. 1918, as amended (5
11.8.0. 751 et seq.), covering the same period
of time, This provision shall not bar the
right of any claimant to the greater benefit
conferred by either Act for. any Pert or the
Same period of time. leetthie this provision
nor any provision of the said Act of Sep-
tember 7. 1918, as amended, shall be so
construed as to deny the right of any par-
ticipant to receive an annuity under this
Act by reason of his own services and to
receive concurrently any payment under
each Act of September 7, 1018, as emended,
by reason of the death of any other person.
(e) Notwithstanding any provision of law
to the contrary, the right of any person en-
titled to an annuity under this Act shall
not be affected because such person has
received an awarder compensation in a lump
sum under Section 14 of the Federal Em-
ployees' Compensation Act of September 7,
1918, as amended (5?13.8.0. 784), except that
ellere such annuity is 'payable on account
or the same disability for which compensa-
tion under such section has ? been paid, so
match of such compensation as has been
pied for any period extended beyond the date
such annuity becomes effective, as deter-
mined by the Secretary of Labor, shall be
refunded to the Department of Labor, to be
peel into the Federal. employees' compensa-
tion fund. Before such person shall receive
such annuity he shall (1) refund to the De-
pertinent of Labor the amount representing
such commuted payments for such extended
peried, or (2) authorize the deduction of
such amount from the annuity' payable to
him under this Act. which amount shall
be transmitted to such Department for reim-
bursement to such rune. Deductions from
such annuity may be made from accrued
and accruing payments, or may be prorated
against and paid from accruing payments in
such manner as the Secretary of Labor shall
determine, whenever he finds that the linen-
earvice
iarvite,
Airelpr-
"siltelk Pont of 1100101:. grOCU
Uninfli:Apaler the
eget"' service that ti
ocedenol wit*4214, peartiloni alas
Sat **(V., may. upon emus**
Money or at any time wine
..ellgthie; for : an aliOnny.,elent,
? 0OntribUtlens to the tumid
;;;Sit- rulpt. eau&
reitne cietenntnit that eopank
In whole. Or In part On the
loyalty to the trotted mates),
? contributions in the fund arid
ivititUttf; computed As pivsertl3ed'
? 231, comingtionig at the age of sway
(b) j.td,'?siarnoipant who has q
accordance With the provisions of
(a) of thle Nation to receive g.
witty octinmincIng at the age' Of-
before reaching the age of sixty his a?
buttons to the fund, with interieCniale.
paid In accordance with, the proving=
sections 241 and 281.
(c) The Director may in tde
retire participants in grade 06-44 and above
If so retired they shall receive r=.
benefits in accordance with the, .
of section 221, provided they have --
he each
ease not less than five years of qualifying
and a total of ten years of serves, with the
Agency. Any individual so retired who does
not meet these service requirements "half
receive the benefits provided line Individual"
in grade 08-13 as set out In paragraph (d):'
at this section.
(e) The Director may in his discretion
retire participants in grade 08-13 and below;
and each such participant shall nionee?,
? (1) ono-twelfth of a year's eatery at bee
then current salary rate fin each year ed
service ane proportionately for a fronton 41d
a year, but not exceeding a total of 000 PA!"
salary at his then current salary rate, pare '
able without interest, froze the fund, lit
equal installments on the lot day Ot Jan-
uary following the participent's retirement
and on the two anniversaries of this date
inunedietely following: Provided, That tis
special cases, the Director may in his dis-
cretion lusoelerate or combine the Install-
ment.; and
(2) a refund of the contributions made to
the fund, with interest ea provided in sec-
tion 241(), except that In lieu of such re-
fend such participant, if he hes at least five
years of service credit toward retirement un-
der the system, excluding military or navel .
service that is credited In s000rdepoe With
the provisions Of section 251 clr 3(1) (3).
May elect to receive retirement banditti on ,
reaching the age of sixty In s000rdenois with'
the provisions of section 221. In the event'
that a participant who eras separated from
grade 013-13 or 08-12 and who bas elected
to receive retirement benefits diet before
reaching the age of sixty, his death shall be
oonsidered a death in service within the
mooning of section 232. In the event that
a participant who was separated &cm grads
GS-li or below and who has elected to re-'
cedes retirement benefits dies before reaching,
the age of sixty, the total amount or his
contributions made to the fund, with Interest
as provided in section 24,1(a), shalt be paid
In Vie, Deo. with in the
tiO8
In accordance with the provisions of section
20(b).
(e) Notwithstanding the provision' of DOC-
titan 3477 of the Revised Statutes as emended
(31 U.S.C. 203), or the provisions of any
other law, a participant who is retired in
accordance with the provisions of paragraph
(d) of this section shall have the right to
assign to any person or corporation the whole
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1063
-4000 --.FPF
IRelease 20 3/20 .:, q1A-RDP
CO
- .
?
ceivIng benefits under
ees" Comp :ajigation Act of nopteraber 7.
' as amende4:(517,13.0.:761 et seq.), and leavea,,
NGRESSION 3-411ECO .R45
? or any part of tinlibenefitereottifieble
? 'easement to paragraph (4) tiLor this
? Mandatory retirement for Aye .
Om 235. (a) Any participant in -the. teratein
In grade 08-18 or above shall 'Upon reaching
the age of sixty-five be retired froth the
Agency and receive retirement 'banal= In
eceortiance with the ?provisions 0i:see:don
221, but whenever the IXreces* sball deter-
lohie it to be in the public interest, he .ay
(Stead =Oh '11'Part*CaP,41-1kArri12,-;teir a
, Perked not to nieeedlive_year,
(b) Any pertielpent. in the system, other
than in grad,e or above. shall upon
reaching the age of sixty be retiredIroril ttie
Agency and reoeive retirement benefits in
aocordance with the provisions of section
221. but whenever the Director shall deter.
mine it to be in the public Interest. he may
extend such a participant's service for a pe-
riod not to exceed Ave years.
Pan, W?WillPoeTTW)TT OP coarsravemers AND
nnsaserr =CMS OP sadellarres MOOT=
Bac. 242. (a) Whenever partrcipant be-
comes separated from the Agency without
becoming eligible for an annuity or a de-
f erred annuity in accordance with the pro-
visions of this Act, the total amount of con-
tributions from his salary with interest there-
on at per cent= per annum, compounded
annually tie of December 31, and propor-
tionately for the period served during the
year of separation including all .contribu-
tions made during or for such period, except
as provided in section 281, shall be returned
to him.
(b) In the event that the total contribu-
tions of a retired participant, other than
voluntary contributions made in accordance
with the provisions of section 281, with in-
terest at 4 per oentum per annum com-
pounded annually as Is provided In para-
graph (a) of this section added thereto, ex-
ceed the total amount returned to such par-
ticipant or to an annuitant claiming through
bun, in the form of annuities, accumulated
at the same rate of interest up to the date
the annuity paynientseesse under the terms
of the annuity, the excess of the accumulated
oontributions over the accumulated annuity
payments shall be paid in the following
order of precedence, upon the establishment
of a valid claim therefor, and such payment
aoall be a bar to recovery by an other person:
(1) the beneficiary or beneficiaries des-
ignated by such participant in writing to the
Director:
(2) If there by no such beneficiary to the
surviving wife or husband of such partic-
ipant;
(3) If none of the above, to the child or
c hiltiren of such participant and descend-
of deceased Children by representation;
(4) If one nf the above, to the parents of
such participant ar the survivcr of them;
(5) if none of the above, to the duly ap-
pointed executor or administrator of the
eetate of such participant;
(6) If none of the above, to other next of
kin of such participant as may be deter-
mined by the Director in his judgment to
b. legally entitled thereto.
(r) No payment eha/1 be made pursuant
to paragraph (b)(6) of this eeatiem until
a:ler the expiration of thirty days from the
death of the retired participant or his *ne-
vi ving annuitant.
Parr T?Mi.JOD BIOLVTVZ POW ATOM:TUX
Cornputatton of length of aerelee
Sac. 251. For the purposes of this Act, the
period of service of a participant snail be
computed from the date he becomes a par-
ticipant under the provisions of this Act,
but all periods of separation from the Agency
and so much of any leaves of absence with-
out pay as may exceed six months in the fag-
In any calendar year shall be ex-
cluded,. except leaves of alment -while re-
of *bonnet_ mitten participants while pewee
? Icirlitinit vs and' Arm Navy.Air 1POritear.1--
risen ".tioncrable military
naval =Mee In the y,
Marine 04?rps, or Ornat Onset Ot tbel3sittim
at! tea?. pi ;or ;en*. ? credit
Sac. (a) &participant may. subtle:de
at the provtdona of this section. Illehliise
his parted Of atireitate-..' ? -"
(1) idviliiiii"earitoi in 'the executive. judk
can, and. legIsletive breaches of the Pederac;
Government end int the District at GoluMben-
government, prior to becoming SP %s
and ? fI"--
(2) active and honorable military or nalral-'Pera "_11174P, (e,), let
service In the Army, Navy. Air Force. litarin?;-.
OM" .Or Comet Guard at the United Statellie,..-:,gen;:ges? a Dot be'.
(b) A particApent may obtain Price oteillert.. Mated cavsrthgjie.1111642-sda
service credit in &Ma:CO.110e With P. _,Pr97 l'..11TOTIVAIA0?.441e 1111140411(Par,k4PeAtt Whihe
visions or Parintrepn- (a) (1) of this *mew 4ierfcirMing active- Military:or naval etinkoll
by making a special contribution to ties- ea eba.diamr. ph,,,T. Airlift". :t
fund equal to 6 per coin= of his basic ? or Come Guard Ge the muted deataa,--7-7,,
annual salary for each year of sank* for pAaT a_agewirT_ 77:71_
?? ,
Animate of eppropristions needed .
which credit is sought prior to November 8,
1960, and at 6% per centum thereafter with
Interest compounded annually at 4 per nen age. The rarectur gaga wapara the-
centum per annum to the date of payment, estimates of the allittlal aperopefealons
Any such participant may, under such con- tinned to be made to the fund, *lid shall
ditions as may be determined In each In- muse to be made actuarial vultlathing Of the 7:-
stance by the Director, pay such special fund at Intervals of five years. et Oftener I:-
contributions in installments. deemed necessary by him. -
(0) (1) If an ofticer or employee under investment of moneys in the/wird
some other Government retirement system
Sec. 262. The Director may, with the ape
becomes a participant In the system by die
rect transfer, such ?Meer or employee's total prove.' of the Secretary of the Treasurrn.
contribution' and deposits, including Interest invest from time to time In interest-bearing .,
such pore
accrued thereon, except voluntary contrtbu-
securities of the United States
tions, shall be transferred to the fund *floc- !ions of the fund as in his judgment may
not be Immediately required for the payment
live aa of the date such officer or employee
of annuities. cash benefits, refunds. and
becomes a participant in the system. Zech allowances. and the income derived from
such Deicer or employee shall be deemed to
consent to the transfer of such funds and such investments shall constitute a part Of .
such transfer shall be a complete discharge such fund.
anti acquittance of all claims and demands Attachments of moneys
against the other Government retirement Svc. 283. None of the moneys mentioned
fund on account of service rendered prior to in this Act shall be sesegnable stiller In lair
becoming a participant in the system. Or equity, or be subject to enenitton.
(2) No participant, whose contributions attachment. garnishment, or other legal ;trona -
are transferred to the fund in accordance OW =cent as provided section234(e). '
with the provisions of paragraph (e) (1) of PAWT 11--WILTrairD PAWTICIPAPTTS ItSCALL131,,
this section. Mall be required to make con- waren exerronrent tar rent aosiecy. 011
tribu dons In addition to these transferred or wron ?
for periods of service for which full con-
aaramtoren rim ger/ear mute
tributions were made to the other Govern- SEC' 271- (a) The Director may recall an -
retired participant to duty In the Ageney
ment retirement fund, nor shall any refund
whenever he shall determine such recall la .
be made to any such participant on account
of contributions made during any period to ,,, the public Interest
the other Government retirement fund at (b) Any such participant recalled to duty
a higher rate than that Axed by section 211 in the Agency In accordance with the pro-
of this Act for contributions to the fund. of paragraph La) of Mb' .___"?41?11-bree,
(3) No participant, whose contributions reinstated or reapPoiniaa aCCOrglanee
are transfered to the fund In accordant* tb? Pecwial?na of eeatb? 231(b) aballe
ea serving, be entitled in lieu of his AIM
with the provisions of paragraph (a)
of this section, shell receive credit for periods to the fullsalary the grade In *bleb be
of service for which a refund of contrfbu- serving. During such service, he shall
contributions to the fund in accordance with'-
mons has been made, or for which no con-
tributions were made to the other Govern-' the provisions of section 211. WIten,he
vette to his retired status, Ids annuity shall .
client retirement fund. A participant may,
c -
however, o5taLn credit for such prior service be determined anew in accordance with the ,
by malting a special contribution to the fund provisions of section 221.
in accordance with the provisions of pare- Reempionmeest
. . . _
graph (b) of this section. Vac. 272. Notwithstax4ing any other, prin.-7!
(d) No particpant may obtain prior civil- vision of law, a participant retired undertue
...,_' N
tan service credit toward retirement under province= of this Act .ball not, by realm.
the system for any period .of Chili= eery-- of his retired status, be barred from enc4.;:"q"
Ice on the basis of which he is receiving ployment In Federal Government service 112.,,L
or will in the future be entitled to receive . any appotutive position for which he is quelema'*:
any annuity under another retirement eye- bled. An annuitant so reemployed shell'7,-.., ,- 4
tern covering civilian personnel of the Gore serve at the will of the appointingeloylne..r,f1.4,:::''
ernment.
Reemployment compensation
(e) A participant may obtain prior mill- .:,....1
tarp or nava] service credit in accordance SAC- 371- 014 moterlataianditil any *then'. ,
with the provisions of paragraph (s) (2) of provision or taw, any anrciaitantl who has re- .'
this section by applying for it to the Di- tired under this Act and who Is reemployed ..
rector prior to retirement or separation from in the Federal Government service in any
the Agency, However, in the case of a par- appointtee position either on a part-time or
Valliant who Is eligible for and reedy:es full-time basis shall be emillied to receive '
retired pay on account of trilhtary or naval the salary of the pc...sit:on in which he is
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? .
ribio:rinut 1." ConiMieke wi
;.,octrober--.
00100050011-2 80
,
?-- -t ?-z---Therepe* JangPOgEllr.rill Lit
eXeiart..thiring any
beste glscey Wen SMOVItjant *' section 2tl3 10
tEi"
vs' Os the Moe of ,.014.01#19.- 10'1 rectorait-
aa suchChatrina.44 aniP4n1.114'
4 grlgt4 4 .4lec- :4
o ttbanentitetted, outuseuthouoarett milt:137sflAe

Alen ?mar
verm reaelves ? wm t4r,
11" 'Ibinbt ?It 16114111" ble frein"Tierti
" Coajekt::kte 1440"Eirbif -1,4215,4110,041:
11;re' slit wilt.'
:Nati of beeeffee , ? ,tattitloo -1..rgai dwelt* -nor*
? 4, Vt544,.. glaCirr ..Theyr
:rautil'"nd 4":1? obleetiVe.
trea *trice Wiserie'datisteartiatterattd. octal rho s -
-tired t"aa t . Urns fireree' Agency: efilotee'arid - ployment." r bell
rerarOoiment t'z'Other DbiestOrAteC1.54- it toilne1000p.
reit informatioa rell-ttng Uvular abased' 'So liffrOt btollY or", , .7,appellie,,ally on Pag '.
s 'su pay directly to such eh- . (it) se specialised heeiuse of aecunty fei.-'. ; at Jioevi.g, to ic-,
'-' huitrth ,140 litlirf or the 'Poeitinn in which" quirsiesets as. to, be twiny dIstirightsheshles" sentence of sootaoh .263 'and
''
he IS Serlrft, , from normal tovernment employment, harti;- , _ _ A, _ . .....__..,,_,. ,
- (OJ fn-tneerent of any overpayment under .te roferredlo airparttoipanta. who shim be in nen thereof the roirowiegi
il.a. T tri
. -
FEthe-rairtry peyelste to such reemploYeo ? Nit. RIVERS ?ot.gloutit Caroline. ,Mr. w emu" are detemuned-brabelnialeaki&' -el
annuitant, -ere from- any ether moneys, in- chairman. , the purpose oi this amend?. ' to..ea , to ,iii support -Of- tisane! ImAleitreit .
this einitiOn. Merit overpayment shall be re- entitled to thebenefits of the tern" The Director may dealt:ate
covererthillifthboldIng the *Mount involved . trNesuch Agency ?deers ind .
eluding' intearinutty; pavane in aceordance,, mem is to establish legislative erittiria abroad hasiccosus life ce batitteeeltilOire,71-
with, the Werrislons of this Act. by which the Agency. would deterMine specianlea, us* of eerturley respairenearta
rArr i?voLuirrair correneurioes those employees who would becorne ishr-: . 113 -th be. Oar, lY nistingniehablelreatiffatunti, A
01,3vernment employment. twee:tee, reftereeit-7:. ,"
SEC: 281, (a)- Any participant may, at his ticipants in this' system. The conimit-
? to as participants, who shall be entitled; trilq- _
option and under such regulations as may be tee during, hearings examined very care- the esoceis or the system,- . -
stunts in multiples of t per centum of his fully, the question of what type of Cm- ? 4asssasper ormico ST' wo.,- ..,?...
prescribed by the Director. deposit additional
bowie palmy. bUt not in excesse of 10 per 1740YeffII should be covered and which em- . Mr. GROSS. Mr. Chtannaii,sfafItir,
centum of such salary, which amounts to- ployees should remain under nornial eivti
substitute amendment: - : .-......)..,,..-:.::,-,,Z-,-*- ..,
ger with interest .at S per cesium per service retirement. ' ? . ' The Clerk read as follows
annum. compounded mutually as of Decem- It was made clear that the ptirpose Was
. Amendment offered by Mr. ...01011111-11a_ a 1
... ..
. .
ber 91, arid proportionately for the period to cover only career employees whose substitute for the amendment offered by Mr.' ,
eluding all contributions made during or for duties and responsibilities. are predom- Ravi= of South Carolina: On page 21?. bet- _.
served during the year of his retirement, In- _
such period, shall, at the date of his retire- inantly concerned with the conduct and
ginning on line 13. strike the aratceentence
support of intelligence activitiee in for- mut insert the following: _, .
ntent find at his election. be?
dditional life the hearings, and with actual (mks as ex- from time to time such agencies, ?Moats; and
employees whose duties are determined by:
the Director to be in 'support of agency se- :
GROSS. Mr. ChairlitailZ, I , '
(1) returned to him in lump sum; or eign countries. It was also developed in _-arte. 203. The Director may designate '
amples furnshed in exeeutive sessions.
that career employees whose duties are
so specialized that they are placed at an
unusual disadvantage when required to
seek other employment would also be
covered by this system.
significant number of these actual
caves were furnished the comMittee in
(2) used to purchase an a
anntiltr or
(3) used to purchase an additional life ,
annuity for himself and to provide for a cash
payment on his death to a beneficiary whose
name shall be notified in writing to the Di-
rector by the participant: Or
(4) used to purchase an additiorial life
annutty for himself and a We annuity com-
mencing on his death payable to a hens-
shalt be notified in
c sr), wn
writing to the Director by the participant
with a guaranteed return to the beneficiary
or his legal representative of an amount
equal to the cash payment referred to in
subPexN3rapb (3) above.
(b) The benefits provided by subpara-
graphs (2), (3), or- (4) of paragraph (a) of
this section shall be actuarially equivalent In
value to the payment provided for by sub-
paragraph (a) (1) of this section and ahall
be -calculated upon such tables of mortality
as may be from time to time prescribed for
this purpose ny the Director,
(c) ..case a participant shall become
separated: from the Agency for any reason
except' retirement on an annuity. the arnount
of any -additional deposits with Interest at
3 per centurn per annum, compounded as 15
provided in paragraph (a) of this section.
Made by him tinder the provisions of said
paragraph (a) .shall be refunded n arf
ner provided in section 241 for the return of
contributions and Interest in the case of
death or separation from..the Agency.
(d) Any benefits payable to a participant
or to his beneficiary in respect to the addi-
tional deposits provided under this section
shall be In addition to the beneete other-
wise provided under this Act.
Mr. RIVERS'of South Carolina (inter-
. .
rupting reading of the bill). Mr. Chair-
man. I ask unanimous consent that the
bill be considered as read and open at
any point to amendment.
The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection
to the request of the gentleman from
South Caronnal
ttvirtes abroad or in this country that are
hazardous to life or health."
. , )
(Mr. GROSS asked and was given
permission to revise and extend ,Jois' '
. ....?
, remarks.) lia..:
'
xecutive hearings to illustrate the before.
types of employees who would be cov-
ered. One of the threads running
through these cases was the hazard both
to person and to health. Employees as
well as their dependents have contracted
diseases which would rarely, if ever, be
found in the United States. We heard
about cases where employees were
wounded or killed by gunfire, and in employee in the CLA who is not consid-
some cases imprisoned. ered to be employed in a security &Bence-
In certain phases of the Agency's aie- Therefore, they could all come under this
tivities there are requiremente for un- language "so specialized because of seeti-e
usual sPecialties requiring long years of rite requirements." Why 'mind- not
arduous training for which skills there every employee of the CIA be Widrethat
/
could be no utilization in normal employ- label, definition and interpretation Al
ment pursuits. ? I said before. I am perfectly vrIlling to
provide a special retirement Program for
We learned of certain situations where.
skills and he himself. bee
throughhazardous life or no fault of the emp Yee, histhese to health. but am
.
the amendment offeredy7 the'. ?
gentleman frotn South Carolina, in_ my
opinion closes the door and reopens
it. I am not willing to leave to the Di-
rector of the CIA the full determination
of normal .- Government employment.
The language also reads to this effect.
"so specialized because of security re
quirements." I do not know .of *MY
whe ar" engaged in w"k th not
it
tb
or tor certain willing to leave it to the Director of the
the needs of the Agency
ame excess

reasons he could no longer be utilized ? CIA t,o include anybody elae in this4ast
effectively by the Agency. - These gre thp retirement program. That is the impart
? people who will be covered?not the ' of my amendment. It does not change
clerk, analyst, or researcher who spends the .remainder section 203. - -
his career in Washington. Mr. CORBETT. - Mr. Chairman. will
In furtherance of the objective of con' ? the. gentleman yield?.
cisely stating these criteria and furnish- Mr. GROSS. I yield to the gentle-
Ing statutory guidelines to the Direttor man.
In eelecting participants without at the Mr. CORBETT. I want to commend
same time imposing undue rigidity, lan- the gentleman for this substitute amend-
gunge has been developed which is ROW,. Ment, that he has offered which would
factory to those members with whom I tighten up a very loose arrangement. In
have consulted arid is also agreeable to the that place taking this kind of action
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Fr t Release 2002/03/20 ? CIA:RDp78-03721A000100050011-2
tAri:
-'01i/tiditESSitit447.*011:14,!:
Sneetafized,s
, the ent say
ty
actiei
berej
in any ,
Seiende
Pe?0,
rue
pension
iidtpi*rop4
. bind*of 6ji? Th2t.0 It has
to be, this .ent of the fittitt*ati
:freed.; '.0e.e40*.#
aceaa t40.00:'
which will proilvi,
health.
Menet question. Stre 6,41 4 qr..
not the first teme On ve
? IA UAL Ian& * PoslUatin/beie thee an-
swer to the question? af Id the genteemet
from Pennsylvania should Ude?
? would impair the national
Mr. CORBETT. ?Thee ii w
the gentleman In those words.
Mr. BATES. I will be lead to give this
information to the gentleman.
Mr. CORBETT. I said If the gentle-
man could answer.
Mr. BATES. I will be gla.d to give thbi
Information to the gentlemen.Personalbe
Mr. conBrrr. Could you imagine
some case that would not be covered by
this? ?
Mr. BATES. Yes Indeed. and I will be
glad to give the information to the
gentleman.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. I can
imagine one, and I will be glad to give
It to you. We need electronics experts
and people with unusual skills requiring
all kinds of training.
Mr. CORl3ETT. If you need them,
why do you retire them early? ?
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Be-
cause the skills may disappear.
Mr. CORSET!'. They may do what?
Mr. RIVER.S of South Carolina. The
need for them may disappear. That is
why.
Mr. BATES. Mr. Chairman. I still
have the floor here.
I would like to say that we did go into
this matter very fully. Both on the
record and off the record we were told
of the type of Individuals who do this
work and the nature of the work which
they perform. We were satisfied as rep-
resentatives of this Congress, with the
answers which were given to us. Al-
though we originally had certain doubts,
when it was all over that doubt was dis-
spelled. It seems to me if this Congress
Is to take action today, It should resolve
the doubt so that the security of our
country would not be impaired.
/ am satisfied in my own mind as to
the need for this second provision and
the wording of the language. When we
went before the Committee on Rules they
had the same problem in their mind.
This is language which has been cleared
by the Committee on Rules and it spells
out what we had in mind when the mat-
ter was considered by the committee. It
seems to me this is as far as we can go
in considering the nature of the matter
under discussion. Therefore, I ask that
the substitute be defeated and ethe
amendment of the gentleman from South
Carolina be passed. '
Mr. JOHANSEN. Mr. Cheleinete will
the gentleman yield?
Mr. BATES. I yield to the gentleman
from Michigan.
Mr. JOHANSEN. I wonder If some of
the misgivings and concern that are be-
ing expressed here, and which I share.
do not arise from the fact that the bill
that the committee brings to the floor
has a completely wide open door. Ap-
rntn
elfl#1,013,1.4itei
'
min sure the gentleman being the rank-
ing minority meniber, of the House COM' e
mittee on Pest Office and OYU Service
will also agree with me that we must
watch carefully from here on out as to
the number of Persons and the expendi-
tures that are made from the retirement
fund because. I repeat, it is $38 billion in
the red and going deeper in the red he
billions of dollars every year.
Mr. CORBETT. And as this bill
stands, you would not know how, many
axe going to be able to draw on the Pen-
sion--whetber it is hundreds or thou-
sands or what the figure might be; is
that not correct?
Mr. GROSS. That is correct
Mr. CORSET!'. I think both in the
Interest of the fund and in the interest
of fairplay for all the rest of the em-
ployees whose paychecks contribute to'
this retirement fund that this restriction
ought to be passed.
Mr. GROS& I again thank the gen-
tleman from Pennsylvania, who is a vet-
eran member of the Post Office and Civil
Service Committee and who takes a lead-
ing Part in the writing of all other re-
tirement legialatione. ,
BATES. Mrrehainxiirie I rise In
support of the amendment and in opposi-
tion to the substitute.
In the course of our hearings the
doubts that were expressed by the gen-
tleman from Pennsylvania and the gen-
tleman from Iowa were also entertained
by the members of the subcommittee.
What they have said on this floor today
is similar to the same statements which
we ourselves made when we were in com-
mittee. Contrary to what the gentle-
man from Pennsylvania said, we did give
this matter deep consideration. We
went into it very thoroughly. So, when
the representatives of the CIA came be-
fore us we asked them specifically what
they had in mind relative to these un-
usual individuals to whom would accrue
these retirement benefits. They spelled
these things out in detail not only with
reference to those engaged in hazardous
work but also those engaged in fields so
specialized that they were very-difficult
to obtain. Upon the completion' of their
remarks the members of our committee
were unanimously satisfied with the an-
se ers to the questions and we understood
fully who was to receive the entitlements
of this particular bill.
CORBE'TT. Mr. Chairman, will
the gentleman yield!,
Mr. BATES. I yield to the gentleman
from Pennsylvania.
Mr. CORBETT. I would like to ask
th r gentleman, if he can, to say what are
iltsefie had a
ogl m..seadild- thought OD the "'matter
? e that serious seeend
14111eitifffieliiitpurportai ,tie 'a
the thought we bare% not a
t but a. primary -thutur
-tir-which 'developed today Is to be
who consideri. this
nd this ..?1
tEcatEnt that would come to theft,
After we vsntlntn tt in I
ociennittee received the asst ?10.110.ez 0
CIA as to wire they had in
wee satisfied with these assurances. 4 ?
JOWMIA4. Mr. chairman,
move to stne eat the last word. ?ee
'Mr. Chairmah, I just raise the quote
lion again?.-and r do net want to be ,un-'
fair to or critical of the committee, but
If', as the gentleman has said, this was
a matter of. such earnest thought._ It
seems to me that It would have been
more timely to propose this ;corr ec Ye
feature before the bill was brought out ;
of the committee. But beyond that. the ,
thing that concerns me?and X think Z
can conceive of a situation very readily
In which it is impossible for security retie
sons to spell out or itemize the types of .
employment or position or job classifica-
tion that are covered?but Is it Possible
in some way, in expressions of members
of the committee to give the clear legis-
lative intent in connection with this par-
ticular matter which will preclude the
very thing which the members of the
Committee on Post Office and Civil Serv-
ice are so much concerned about? -
Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, will the,
gentleman? yield?
'Mr. JOHANSEN. I am ham, to yle14';'-
. ?
to the gentleman from Virginia.
Mr. HARDY. I think the only way'
that that could be cleared up?and it ?
cannot be expressed here on the floor?
's this. I will say to the gentleman that
the transcript Of the hearings is curie
plete, that all of these phases were dis-
cussed fully by the subcommittee over a
long period of time. There are classified
transcripts of the hearings that are in
the committee safe, and they establish
without question the intent of the CIA
with respect t9 the application of this
ntonoset ? ,
Mr. JOHANSEN. I assume, therCfOre. .
that I have the commitment of the gen-
tleman from Virginia that the subcom-
mittee of the Committee on Armed Serv-
ices ? will police the matter to see that
that intent is not violated?
Mr. HARDY.. .1 am assured by the
chairman of the full committee that the
matter will be policed.
Mr. RIVElt of South Carolina. Mr.
Chairman, will the gentleman yield?
Mr. JOHANSEN. ?I yield to the chair-'
man of the subcommittee.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina.' Ur.
Chairman, I was going to give the gen-
tleman the same assurance that the gen-
tleman for Virginia I Mr. ileseel gave..
What I read was this: In certain phases
of the Agency's activities there are re-
quirements for unusual specialties re-
quiring !Ong years of arduous training
for which in some cases there could be
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prOyeq For,Nurlibiamtogiciteme_o ytbv
or
Mr.
.082!se
leaded f
.ftAtr"oll fir4=70.t.romi?74.ia
14,a4
x
PIWired. eler' _
-Una.?ihe
gentleman JkaSttrances that
? we have carefully Policeil this work.
Mr. GROSS.. fdfr, Ottitirmant will the
gentleman Yield?
Mr. J011ittlnlf. '
GROSS. The gentleman from
South Carolina says that this early re-
tirement is necessary in part to take care
of specialties, and he mentioned elec-
? trollies. imagine we have several
thousand SPeelfillStS in electronics
throughout the Government. If we are
going to provide early-retirement for all
the specialists in electronics throughout
the Government, that $38 billion that
the retirement fund is in the red will
be $50 billion if this is the criteria you
are going to use to try to convince us
that we ought to give early retirement to
whomsoever the Director of the CIA may
select.
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Mr.
Chairman, will the gentleman yield?
Mr. JOHANSEN. I yield.
? Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. Mr.
Chairman, in response to the gentleman
from Iowa there are many specialties. I
happened to mention electronics. There
are many that we cannot mention. We
know what they are. But we cannot
here open up the heart of the CIA to
everybody.
Mr. JOHANSEN. Of course, we do not
expect the gentleman to do that and we
would not request it for a moment.. In
taking this time I believe I have received
what I asked for, which was the assur-
ance that there was a clear legislative
intent in the record of the subcommittee
and the assurances of the committee and
the subcommittee chairmen and the dis-
tinguished chairman of the full commit-
tee, that the matter would be carefully
? Mr. rawats of South Carolina. The
gentleman has it.
Mr. JOHANSEN. I appreciate that. I
will say too that I trust the gentleman -
understands a little bit of the distrust
that some of us on the legislative com-
mittee have toward the bureaucracy.
The CHAIRMAN, The question is on t
the substitute amendment offered by the
gentleman from Iowa, to the amendment
offered by the gentleman from South
Carolina.
The question was taken: and on a
division (demanded by Mr. ()toss) there
were?ayes, 20, noes, 87,
So the substitute amendment was
rejected.
W
The CHAIRMAN. The question now
recurs on the amendment offered by the a
gentleman from South Carolina.
The amendment was agreed to.
Knanencnev, It would be vary Intermit-
ng to take a trip to the moon. But I-can-
n
? and' PriIj4ii?io onosideb,
rd ft '10tf 1101PAUtImi to
atter eteeroyeil by the &airtimn. and ranking
minority Members or the Armed Serviees
? Cs mittleft, Nouse anti Benass.*L
_.24);:'*VZRE3-'.of South&Minas *if
Chaintriall. Wilk the gentler:1W 310,4?...
)1r../ON723 _of Missouri: I yield to"
the gentlemoiii from South Carolina:*
Mr. RIVERS of South Carolina. We
accept your amendment.
Mr. JONES of Missouri. I thank_ the
gentleman.? ?
The CHAIRMAN. The question Is .06
the amendment offered by the gentle-
man from Missouri [Mr Joan]
The amendment was agreed to.
Mr. MILLER of California, Mr.
Chairman,! move to strike the requisite
number of words.
(Mr. MT1IPR, of California asked and
was given permission to speak out of
order and to revise and extend his re-
marks.) ?
Mr. MILLER of California. Mr.
Chairman, we have all listened now to
a lot of interpretations concerning what
Premier Khrushchev meant when he
talked about the Soviet moon program on
October 28. I would like to point out
that most of the interpretations which
have been enuelated thus far have come
from those with no direct connection
with, or responsibility for, the space pro-
gram. I have taken the trouble to look
up the exact transcript of Mr. KhrU-
shcheVe remarks and I heartily commend
It to the attention of every Member of
House. A careful reading of what Mr.
Khrushchev actually said, to my mind,
does not indicate that the Soviets are
cutting down on their own space pro-
gram: it does not indicate that they are
not heading for a manned lunar orbit in
the near future; it does not indicate that
they are abandoning any part of their
original plans.
Let me make one other point. The
fact that we have not heard much lately
concerning any deep space efforts on the
part of the Soviets does not at all mean
that they have not been attempting
them. We can be pretty certain that ?
they have been making a number of
complex attempts which in one way or
another have not succeeded. They, like
ourselves, have run into a very advanced
technical area where the developmental
going is rough. Very possibly they are
having enough scientific and engineering
roubles to keep them relatively quiet.
Mr. Sneaker, the precise comments of "
Chairman Khrushchev follow: ?
Journalist Leopold Vargas, of Colombia
asks. Can you tall us whether a night to the
moon by Soviet cosmonauts is planned fOr
the not too distant future? ?
stoat
their expiciftsesoti
want to IPOInPfta ,W4
at at present say when ,this win be done.
are not at Twesent planning flights by
osnronauts to the moon Soviet scientists
re working on this problem. It is being
tud led ass scientific problem and We neees.
ary research it being done. I have a report
Pie to Ans moon
ttout Is is clear
&eyed bole
006 .trary. 1t Toni
rNult In ths4tr
atftequsetlyqlotae
boar ft any laegar,-ear
*moon. But, we are an
speak illartoolliti. Misch
done and good preparatiima
Maul eight to the moop by Man.
Mr. Chairman, I *salt to `reiOra
whist I have said thls floor Many' .
tintea; that in sending- st man tO"the!::
moon We are doing so not beauties- we.
are in competition with the Reading oe:
anyone else but because this program'.
Is designed as a part of the scienlifie
facet of the exploration of outer waft.
The information we develop froM AMA
Program will be used In that exploration.
I for one am not ready to see the leader-
ship in this field ourrendered to the Rus-
sians.
The CHAIRMAN. Under the rule, the
Committee rises.
Accordingly, the Committee rose: suid
the Speaker having resumed- the chair,
Mr, 'IsliostraS, Chairman of the Commit-
tee of the Whole House on the State
of the Union, reported that that Com-
mittee, having had under consideration
the bill (H.R. 8427) to provide for the
establishment and maintenance of a
Central Intelligent* Agency retirement
and disability system for a limited num;-
ber of employees, and for other purposes,'
pursuant to House Resolution 843, here-
ported the bill back to the House with
sundry amendments adopted by the
Committee of the Whole.
The SPEAKER. Under the rule, the
previous question is ordered. '
? Is a separate vote demanded on any
amendment?
? If not, the Chair tein put them en
grog.
:The amendments were agreed to.
-The SPEAKER. The question is on
the engrossment and third reading Of
the bill
' The -bill was ordered to be erigrOssed
and read a third time, and was read the
third time.
The SPEAKER, The question is on
the passage of the bill.
The bill Was passed.
- A motion to 'reconsider was told on
the table.
arrutrainrr or unDaLE7
NOBLE _
(Mr. GARY asked and was given per-
mission to address the House for
minute and to revise and Wend his fa- -
marks.) . ,
Mr. GARY. Mr. Speaker, *on the last
day of this month Mr. Lizeisley IL Noble
will retire from his position as Deputy
Assistant Postmaster General and Con-
roller of the Post ?nice Department.
when 14r. Noble joined the Post Office
Departtnent on September 1, 1955, as Its
Approved For Release 2002/03/20 : CIA-RDP78-03721A000100050011-2